IRC logs of #boinc for Tuesday, 2007-11-27

00:13 *** Tank_Master has joined #BOINC

00:18 <rubiks120> hey guys

00:19 <Tank_Master> yo

00:19 <rubiks120> whats up

00:20 <mweltin> not much cleaning up code and tyring to get this stupid app to compilein msvs

00:21 <Tank_Master> hehe

00:21 <rubiks120> msvs? microsoft visual studios?

00:21 <mweltin> yup

00:21 <mweltin> i have no idea what I'm doing

00:21 <rubiks120> cant stand that ide

00:21 <mweltin> I can't stand most ide's

00:21 <mweltin> I thought eclipse was cool for a while

00:21 <rubiks120> Ive never had more trouble with an ide/compiler

00:21 <mweltin> but its sucks too.

00:22 <rubiks120> have you tried Anjuta?

00:22 <mweltin> no

00:23 <rubiks120> its one of the better ones I have used

00:24 <mweltin> for windows?

00:24 <rubiks120> oo no, sorry

00:24 <rubiks120> thats a linux one, not sure if its windows supported

00:24 <rubiks120> doesnt look like it

00:25 *** Tank_Master_ has quit IRC

00:26 <rubiks120> mweltin, are you having trouble with a windows version of your program?

00:27 <mweltin> yes and no.  Pov builds it for me all the time, but I feel like I should be able to to it too.

00:27 <rubiks120> so its more of an educational thing

00:28 <mweltin> well technically yes, but I also need todo it because i can depend on Pov all the time.

00:28 <rubiks120> yea

00:28 <rubiks120> that makes sense

00:30 <rubiks120> how does one go about starting a project like that, I have always been a bit curious, I dont think I have the programming know how to actually make one though

00:30 <mweltin> well that is a very good question.

00:30 <mweltin> its doens't take a lot, but you should be able to program in C an C++

00:30 <mweltin> you dont' need to be very good but you do need that as a skill

00:31 <mweltin> you have to write your app, and about six other funcitons to have a working project.

00:31 <mweltin> David Anderson made it about as simple as possible.

00:31 <mweltin> in some cases you don't even need to do that

00:31 <mweltin> just write you app and you are done.

00:32 <mweltin> of course I can say that now, but its taken two months and I'll be in beta for at least another week.

00:32 <mweltin> brb

00:32 <rubiks120> interesting, I am somewhat proficient with C, and I have a pretty good book on it I can read it fairly easily and do some more simple coding

00:32 <rubiks120> ok

00:33 <rubiks120> my most complicated project was probably a tic tac toe game, console based

00:34 <Tank_Master> hehe

00:34 <Tank_Master> nice

00:35 <rubiks120> gotta do something to pass the nights when people start to go to sleep, I am a bit of a night person up till 2 or 3 on a regular basis

00:35 <rubiks120> I just have trouble coming up with ideas for projects

00:37 <mweltin> well you have all the skill you need for a boinc project

00:37 <rubiks120> cool

00:38 <mweltin> oh and a word of adivce

00:38 <rubiks120> now if I had a project idea I might have something to work on

00:38 <mweltin> getting the project working is not hard

00:39 <mweltin> its everything after that

00:39 <mweltin> all the stuff you don't expect that takes a while.

00:39 <rubiks120> mantaining the project?

00:39 <mweltin> but dont worrie rubiks120 you found #boinc and you can get all the help you need here.

00:39 <mweltin> sign up for the projects mailing list too.

00:40 <mweltin> lots of good info goes through there

00:40 <Tank_Master> maintaining: putting up with people's"I cant get work" "my crredits arent being granted" ;)

00:40 <mweltin> David Anderson keeps a tight eye on that list as well.

00:40 <rubiks120> haha

00:40 <rubiks120> tank now your going to make me feel bad, that was me earlier today =P

00:40 <Tank_Master> hehe

00:40 <mweltin> oh gosh you will get no positive energy when it comes to credits

00:40 <Tank_Master> I was doing it to

00:41 <Tank_Master> LOL

00:41 <Tank_Master> true dat

00:41 <rubiks120> yea thats the unfortunate part, credits are what keep people interested

00:41 <mweltin> everyone does it, I can understand that too, becaue that is all you get out of it.

00:41 <mweltin> besides a feeling of helping

00:41 <Tank_Master> yep

00:42 <mweltin> ok, not everyone complains

00:42 <mweltin> but the ones that do pipe up about credits have very strong feelings about it.

00:42 <rubiks120> I can see it from both sides, but hey if my credits start not working watch out =P

00:42 <rubiks120> jk

00:42 <mweltin> I caved in and I'm making an app that has fixed credits and an app that gives out credits based on cpu time.

00:43 <rubiks120> gotta keep the userbase happy

00:43 <mweltin> I'm ready for you.  When you first start your project the fist people there are very very nice and understanding about credits.

00:43 <mweltin> most just are excited to see a new project

00:44 <mweltin> they will offer all kinds of good suggestions.

00:44 <Tank_Master> like I was

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00:44 <rubiks120> well if you have any interesting ideas on a project, let me know and ill look into it and see if I can get enough of an understanding to start coding something

00:44 <mweltin> like Tank_Master  was

00:44 <mweltin> or is I hope

00:45 <Tank_Master> naw, was just a one time thing

00:45 * Tank_Master will now just be an @$$

00:45 <mweltin> well, if you want to code for TSP  there are a few things you can do for it.

00:45 <Tank_Master> lol

00:45 <Tank_Master> j/k

00:45 <mweltin> lol

00:45 <Tank_Master> like I would know what to do with code

00:45 <mweltin> not you, rubiks120

00:46 <Tank_Master> oh, right

00:46 <rubiks120> mweltin, I was going to say, I have been looking through the source a bit but I dont have much of an understanding for it yet

00:47 <mweltin> no worries, we can start small

00:47 *** f0urtyfive has quit IRC

00:47 <mweltin> do any genetic algorithm stuff?

00:47 <rubiks120> nope, but I can look it up see what its about

00:48 <mweltin> what do you study at school ?

00:48 <rubiks120> Im a mechanical engineering major

00:48 <Tank_Master> chicks and beer

00:48 <rubiks120> but computers are a big hobby of mine

00:48 <mweltin> oh yeah thats right

00:48 <mweltin> thats perfect

00:48 <mweltin> ahhhhh lets see

00:49 <rubiks120> I love lookin at source code, writing random little programs to do stuff, learning to write scripts

00:49 <mweltin> so TSP will be all about search algorithms.

00:49 <rubiks120> ok

00:49 <mweltin> do any database work?

00:50 * Tank_Master thinks mweltin is trying to recrute rubiks120

00:50 <rubiks120> not much I have a basic understanding though

00:50 <Tank_Master> :)

00:50 <mweltin> ya think ?

00:50 <Tank_Master> LOL

00:50 <rubiks120> Tank... thats ok with me, kinda what I was hopin for =P

00:50 <Tank_Master> good

00:50 <rubiks120> somewhere to get help or at least pushed in the right direction

00:50 <rubiks120> to learn stuff

00:51 <Tank_Master> one and half heads are better than three quarters

00:51 <mweltin> I have web work I need to get done too

00:51 <mweltin> LOL

00:51 <mweltin> but I think you should be working on a search algorithm, or maybe a small part of one.

00:51 <mweltin> wait

00:52 <mweltin> you have the code righ.

00:52 <rubiks120> I've done a little bit of that I helped my schools robotics team with some website stuff

00:52 <rubiks120> I do have the code

00:53 <mweltin> yeah website work sucks it will all be headach crap dealing with google maps api and why it doesn't work in IE.

00:53 <mweltin> no you want something cool

00:53 <mweltin> something that will take TSP to the next level

00:53 <zombie67> don't be fooled.  BOINC (any DC) is a social tool.

00:54 <Tank_Master> :)

00:54 <mweltin> ok here is genetic algorithms 101 by markus

00:54 <zombie67> if you cannot manage people, you cannot manage a DC

00:54 <mweltin> are you calling me a "social tool"?

00:54 <zombie67> project

00:54 <zombie67> heh

00:54 <rubiks120> well managing people isnt all that hard

00:54 <Tank_Master> no, in your case, yous justa tool

00:54 <mweltin> LOL

00:54 <Tank_Master> ;)

00:54 <mweltin> I was waiting for that

00:54 <rubiks120> haha

00:54 <Tank_Master> hehe

00:54 <mweltin> thanks Tank_Master

00:54 <Tank_Master> np

00:55 <Tank_Master> you know I couldnt resist

00:55 <zombie67> not managing, as in a boss, but as in herding cats

00:55 <mweltin> ok rubiks120 so a GA (genetic algorithm) is a program that works on part dawinian and part modern genetic methods.

00:55 <rubiks120> o, well that is a bit different I guess cant say I have done that one yet

00:55 <rubiks120> ok

00:56 <mweltin> instead of a strand of DNA that gets mutated and mated with other strands you have a string.

00:57 <mweltin> the string (C++ string object) is a list of cities to visit.

00:57 <mweltin> the fist city in the string is the first city you visit and the last city in the string is the last city you visit.

00:57 <rubiks120> ok, Im pretty sure I found that in the code somewhere

00:57 <mweltin> i think they are vectors in the code I forget

00:57 <rubiks120> could be

00:58 <mweltin> it's not written very well

00:58 <mweltin> but that is where you come in.

00:58 <mweltin> so anya

00:58 <mweltin> anyway

00:58 <rubiks120> ok

00:58 <mweltin> you start with 100 strings of random permutations.

00:58 <Tank_Master> and you unrandomize them

00:58 <mweltin> each string has to have all the cites 1-48 but the order doesn't matter.

00:58 <mweltin> I'm getting to that.

00:59 <Tank_Master> :)

00:59 <zombie67> the difference between popular projects, and the others has a lot to do with 1)  admin involvement  2) somehow making people feel like they have a say, and a real impact on the project, and 3) credits

00:59 <rubiks120> so 100 strings with 48 cities in random order

00:59 <mweltin> yup

00:59 <Tank_Master> mw is defently involved

00:59 <mweltin> first step is to rank them by fitness

00:59 <Tank_Master> which makes it fun(y)

01:00 <mweltin> their fitness is = the distance yo have to travel to get to the cities in the ordre they are listed in the genome (i.e. string)

01:00 <mweltin> if you look at the getdist or getDistance fuction that is what it does.

01:00 <rubiks120> and Im assuming in the cities instance the lower the distance the more fit?

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01:01 <mweltin> correct-A-mundo!

01:01 <rubiks120> ok

01:01 <Tank_Master> what about road access?

01:01 <mweltin> ok so now that they are ranked you have to start picking mating pairs.

01:01 <mweltin> flying car

01:01 <mweltin> now there are a lot of ways to do this.

01:01 <rubiks120> clearly thats the answer... flyin car

01:02 <Tank_Master> if a freeway goes to a city 5 miles farther and a highway going to the closer city, wouldnt the farther city be accessable faster?

01:02 <rubiks120> theoretically

01:02 <Tank_Master> baring no traffic or bridge collaping

01:03 <mweltin> wwwdoc.ic.ac.uk/~nd/surpise_96/journal/vol4/tcw2/report.html

01:03 <mweltin> is a good place to start

01:03 <mweltin> I do a tournament selection

01:04 <rubiks120> bad link there

01:04 <rubiks120> I tried a . after www but that didnt work

01:04 <mweltin> you pick x genomes from the population and then you select

01:04 <mweltin> I typed it by hand

01:04 <mweltin> sorry

01:04 <rubiks120> its ok

01:04 <mweltin> google genetic algorithms

01:05 <mweltin> anyway

01:05 <rubiks120> ok

01:05 <mweltin> you pick 4 individuals lets say

01:05 <mweltin> what ever method you pick to figure out which one gets moved to the mating population it needs to be baed on fitness

01:06 <rubiks120> ok that makes sense

01:06 <mweltin> but there should also be a small chance that a less fit individual gets put in the mating pop.

01:06 <mweltin> so you do that until you have 100 mating pops

01:06 <mweltin> now comes cross over

01:06 <mweltin> mate 1 = 1,2,3,4,a,b,c,d

01:06 <mweltin> mate 2 = e,f,g,h,5,6,7,8

01:07 <rubiks120> ok

01:07 <mweltin> you pick some random point along the string

01:08 <mweltin> so kid one is the first part of mate one and the second part of mate two

01:08 <rubiks120> ok so you match the numbers and the letters

01:08 <mweltin> and kid two is the second part of mate1 and the first part of mate two

01:08 <mweltin> well that would be the end result of my little example but yes

01:09 <mweltin> the point where the crossover occures is picked at randome

01:09 <mweltin> and all the individuals have numbers and no letters

01:09 <mweltin> but you get the idea.

01:09 <rubiks120> ok

01:09 <mweltin> so out of the mating you get 100 new individuals

01:10 <mweltin> well

01:10 <mweltin> I only get 99

01:10 <mweltin> then you mutate them

01:11 <mweltin> it the genome is a binary string it amounts to flipping bits at random spots

01:11 <mweltin> you do this very infrequently  0.001 % of the time

01:11 <mweltin> maybe more

01:11 <rubiks120> ok

01:11 <mweltin> but we can't do that here

01:11 <mweltin> so what I do it

01:11 <mweltin> flip cite postions

01:11 <mweltin> e.g.

01:11 <rubiks120> because we arent dealing with binary directly?

01:12 <mweltin> 1,2,3,4,5,6

01:12 <mweltin> becomes 1,2,3,5,4,6

01:12 <mweltin> yes

01:12 <rubiks120> ok

01:12 <mweltin> we always have to look at a city as a whole.

01:12 <mweltin> if we just started flipping bits

01:12 <rubiks120> we lose the city

01:12 <mweltin> we could end up with city 1334

01:13 <mweltin> which doesn't exist

01:13 <rubiks120> ok

01:13 <mweltin> so the final touch is

01:13 <mweltin> to copy over the best fit individual from the previous generation unaltered.

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01:13 <mweltin> now we have a new population of 100

01:13 <mweltin> and the process starts all over again.

01:14 <rubiks120> and that will keep looking for a while, basically creating new populations by mating the previous one for n number of populations?

01:14 <mweltin> yup

01:15 <mweltin> the trick if finding a balancing the mutation and crossover

01:15 <rubiks120> seems simple enough

01:15 <mweltin> if mutation is too high that is the same as a random search

01:16 <mweltin> if it is too low you can stall out

01:16 <mweltin> all members of your population have the same genome

01:16 <mweltin> my last GA was stalling out quickly

01:16 <rubiks120> so if not enough mutation you end up with one string that just repeats?

01:17 <mweltin> yes

01:17 <rubiks120> and thats the basic principles behind the code that you are running for tsp?

01:17 <mweltin> the classic way to explain a seach algorithm is to think of a topo map

01:17 <mweltin> you want to find the higest point

01:18 <mweltin> no right now TSP is a brute froce method

01:18 <rubiks120> oo

01:18 <rubiks120> that explains the bruteforce.cpp

01:18 <mweltin> its going over every permutation to find the right answer.

01:18 <mweltin> yeah

01:18 <mweltin> so you toss a bunch of wads of gum on the map

01:19 <mweltin> they all stick somewhere.

01:19 <rubiks120> this is sounding like an interesting analogy

01:19 <mweltin> and you check the hight they are at

01:19 <mweltin> in a random search you would just do that over and over and hope you hit the higest point.

01:20 <rubiks120> yup

01:20 <mweltin> in a GA you look at the ones that are the highest and figure

01:20 <mweltin> well there is a good chance that the highest point on the map is near here.

01:20 *** Celelibi has joined #boinc

01:20 <mweltin> so you look close by, and you favor the highest point at the time.

01:21 <mweltin> if your mutation rate is too high its liek tossing out a new set of gum wads.

01:21 <rubiks120> then you get back to the random search

01:21 <mweltin> the crossover gives you a chance to find new places to test on the map

01:21 *** yoyo[RKN] has joined #boinc

01:22 <mweltin> something a gradient decent algorithm would not do.

01:22 <rubiks120> now is your goal to implement an algorithm like this one?

01:22 <mweltin> the gradient decent would simple walk up from where it was until it got to the a local maximum

01:22 <mweltin> say the top of what ever mountian was near by.

01:22 <mweltin> GA fist

01:23 <mweltin> then some others from graph theory.

01:23 <yoyo[RKN]> morning

01:23 <yoyo[RKN]> is Tank_Master here?

01:23 <mweltin> hey yoyo

01:23 <rubiks120> yea, I meant GA I didnt think you had moved on to a gradient decent yet

01:23 <mweltin> nearest neighbor in graph theory is to pick a random city

01:23 <mweltin> and find its nearest neighbor

01:24 <mweltin> and then its nearest neighbor and so on and so on to build your path.

01:24 <mweltin> not many of those paths

01:24 <mweltin> so its not worth making a project app out of it

01:24 <mweltin> yeah sorry ga

01:24 <mweltin> look I gotta run

01:24 <mweltin> dinner and all

01:24 <rubiks120> ok

01:24 <mweltin> I'll be back

01:25 <mweltin> check out google for now

01:25 <mweltin> we can talk alter

01:25 <rubiks120> enjoy thanks for the explainations, no guarnatees I will still be awake

01:25 <yoyo[RKN]> does anybody know if Seti.USA will take part at the WCG Christmas race?

01:25 <rubiks120> but if not I will catch you tomorrow

01:25 <mweltin> no worries

01:26 <Tank_Master> I havent gotten a responce for the founder yet

01:26 <Tank_Master> y?

01:27 <yoyo[RKN]> ok

01:30 <yoyo[RKN]> for the time of the race beeing you can crunch in our team to take part. exceptional we will allow it ;)

01:35 <Tank_Master> ?

01:36 <Tank_Master> I think our current 5kRAC there will kick @$$ is it is...

01:36 <Tank_Master> as*

01:40 <Tank_Master> hey

01:40 <Tank_Master> yoyo

01:40 <Tank_Master> vote yes please ;)

01:40 <rubiks120> looks like you scared him away :-p

01:40 <Tank_Master> he's on my team's mb right now

01:40 <rubiks120> mb?

01:40 <Tank_Master> or was in the last 15 min

01:40 <Tank_Master> message board

01:40 <rubiks120> oo

01:41 <rubiks120> do you hold a high spot on that team?

01:41 <Tank_Master> I wish

01:41 <Tank_Master> im 15th or so

01:41 <Tank_Master> we have 4 of the top 5 people in SETI

01:41 <rubiks120> yea, I noticed in seti you guys are number 1

01:41 <Tank_Master> dont have Nez, but everyone else

01:42 <Tank_Master> 2 of the top work for a university

01:42 <rubiks120> so they run it at the univsersity?

01:42 <Tank_Master> err the top two... on my team

01:42 <Tank_Master> yep

01:42 * yoyo[RKN] voted yes

01:42 <Tank_Master> its sounds funny when they ay "yeah, ill add a few hundered comps to that project"

01:42 <rubiks120> Im really hopin to get my 2nd computer, theres so much I want to do in terms of having a personal server

01:42 <Tank_Master> cool, thx yoyo ;)

01:43 <Tank_Master> yeah, it is convenient

01:43 <rubiks120> a few hundred pcs would be nice

01:43 <Tank_Master> when I hed two comps at home, one was a file server and the other a gamming server

01:43 <Tank_Master> lol, that it would

01:43 <rubiks120> right now Im at just my laptop

01:44 <Tank_Master> at leats it rune

01:44 <Tank_Master> runs*

01:44 <rubiks120> but i could pick up 2 pcs over the next month or so

01:44 <Tank_Master> cool

01:44 <rubiks120> yea, it was top of the line about 2 yrs ago

01:44 <Tank_Master> hehe

01:44 <Tank_Master> funny how that works

01:44 <rubiks120> still fast if I actually dedicated the cpu cycles

01:45 <Tank_Master> today's top of the line is tomorrow's trash

01:45 <rubiks120> dual core 1.83 ghz, but Im only running at about 50% for boinc

01:45 <mweltin> back

01:45 <Tank_Master> y not 100?

01:45 <rubiks120> yea, its rediculous the way technology is moving

01:45 <Tank_Master> heat?

01:45 <Tank_Master> wb MW

01:45 <rubiks120> yea keepin the heat down

01:46 <rubiks120> it runs half at about 50C which isnt horrible

01:46 <Tank_Master> reading what intel is saying, they are hoping to get 3Tflpos on one chip by 2010/2011

01:46 <mweltin> did I miss anything good

01:46 <Tank_Master> not really

01:46 <Tank_Master> yoyo voted yes on something for me

01:46 <rubiks120> na, just some computer conversation

01:47 <Tank_Master> but that died abruply

01:47 <rubiks120> yea, Im also dealin with a friend with boyfriend issues, those are never fun

01:48 <Tank_Master> no

01:48 <mweltin> LOL

01:48 <mweltin> sorry

01:48 <Tank_Master> :)

01:48 <rubiks120> its ok she seems like shes doing ok now

01:48 <Tank_Master> I hope the firend is female?

01:48 <rubiks120> which is good that means I can go back to reading

01:48 <rubiks120> yea

01:48 <rubiks120> she is

01:48 <Tank_Master> good ;)

01:48 <Tank_Master> its worse if its a male

01:48 <rubiks120> I dont think I have any gay friends

01:49 <rubiks120> at least... openly gay

01:49 <mweltin> I'm just a tad cynical after my divorce

01:49 <Tank_Master> yeah

01:49 <mweltin> when I hear someone is having trouble

01:49 <Tank_Master> the brother of a girl I dated was gay

01:49 <mweltin> I always forget that it can be serious

01:49 <rubiks120> divorces mess a lot of things up, my current girlfriend is havin a lot of problems becuase her parents separated

01:49 <rubiks120> brb

01:50 <Tank_Master> hehe, bet after a devorce, small things like this dont seem to be that big a deal

01:50 <Tank_Master> bummer

01:50 <mweltin> lots of things got put into perspective

01:50 <Tank_Master> you helpin her out?

01:50 <rubiks120> ya

01:50 <rubiks120> gotta run down and talk to her quick

01:50 <Tank_Master> I woldnt know

01:50 <mweltin> no she is on her own.

01:50 <mweltin> we didn't have kids or anything

01:50 <Tank_Master> ok, hf rub

01:51 <mweltin> we didn't even need lawyers

01:51 <Tank_Master> thats good

01:51 <mweltin> as far as divorces go it was good.  I have seen a lot go bad

01:51 <mweltin> just ugly crap

01:52 <Tank_Master> my mom's sister broke up with her husbend

01:52 <Tank_Master> the doughter now is a freak

01:52 <mweltin> one chick bought a lexus SUV moved out and stuck her husband with hte bill

01:52 <Tank_Master> goth, toren clothes, dropout...

01:52 <Tank_Master> ouch

01:52 <Tank_Master> thats just mean

01:53 <mweltin> yeah

01:53 <Tank_Master> but.. if its in his name...

01:53 <mweltin> another friend 13 years of marriage she decides she is gay and moves out

01:54 <Tank_Master> cant he keep it?

01:54 <Tank_Master> gaww, thats just not right

01:54 <mweltin> sticks him with all the debt they racked up

01:54 <mweltin> the car is hers and she is hiding from him.

01:57 <efc> find me one that likes crappy cars

01:59 * Tank_Master is off to bed

01:59 <Tank_Master> &nn all

01:59 <Romulus> Live long and crunch!

02:00 <mweltin> I heard there was a village in western mongolia where there was a woman who had a sister that once said she like a crappy cars, but she admits she could have been mistaken

02:00 <mweltin> later Tank_Master

02:02 <mweltin> I have to put using namespace std as the first line

02:02 <mweltin> it mess up everything

02:02 <mweltin> I like my includes first

02:02 <mweltin> then code stuff

02:02 <mweltin> C++ is like the car from the beverly hillbillies

02:03 <mweltin> good car under a lot of junk held on with bailing wire.

02:08 * yoyo[RKN] is off to work

02:08 <zombie67> wow, missed a whole conversation while i blinked

02:08 <zombie67> yoyo:  trying to get seti.usa signed up

02:08 <yoyo[RKN]> ;)

02:09 <zombie67> you work??

02:09 <yoyo[RKN]> yeah

02:10 <zombie67> bah!

02:10 <zombie67> I work, but from home

02:10 <yoyo[RKN]> yoyo@home is only a sparetime project

02:10 <yoyo[RKN]> I work at work

02:10 <zombie67> wasting time commuting, fuel too

02:11 <yoyo[RKN]> but meeting lot of people there

02:11 <zombie67> are not you and I talking?

02:11 <zombie67> am i at your work?

02:11 <yoyo[RKN]> ;)

02:11 <zombie67> could we not talk via phone, IM, IRC, video?

02:12 <yoyo[RKN]> but not drinking coffee together

02:12 <zombie67> bah!

02:12 <zombie67> drinking together is for beer!

02:13 <yoyo[RKN]> btw, mac client is in preparation

02:13 <zombie67> sweeeeet!

02:13 <zombie67> but I won't be able to participate until 12/25

02:13 <yoyo[RKN]> ;)

02:13 <efc> Where is this village in eastern mongolia... I don't think my car will make it there though

02:16 *** yoyo[RKN] has quit IRC

02:18 <Tank_Master> is it a bad thing when it rains then clears at night and gets below 32f?

02:20 <efc> Not if you like sliding

02:20 <Tank_Master> or have ice skates

02:26 <zombie67> wtf?  how far are you from the coast?

02:32 <zombie67> changing computers

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02:33 <zombie67> by quad chips arrive tomorrow!

02:35 <efc> Sweet

02:39 <zombie67> two PDs to be replaced by Q6600s, one of which is OC-able

02:43 <rubiks120> ahh that took a lot longer then I had hoped for

02:44 <zombie67> colon blow?

02:44 <rubiks120> friend with problems

02:44 <zombie67> even worse

02:45 <rubiks120> yea

02:46 <rubiks120> delaying my bedtime, but hey i can still get 5 and a half hours not too bad

02:46 <rubiks120> but Im going now so night all

02:46 <zombie67> gn

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02:47 <quail> &ping

02:47 <Romulus> pong

02:47 <zombie67> wankage

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03:47 <CoderForLife> &weather 45140

03:47 <Romulus> CoderForLife: Temperature: 37.8F / 3.2C | Humidity: 83% | Pressure: 30.20in / 1022.6hPa | Conditions: Haze | Wind Direction: West | Wind Speed: 2.0mph / 3.2km/h ; Tonight - Cloudy. Lows in the lower 30s. Northwest winds around 10 mph.; Tuesday - Partly sunny. Highs in the lower 40s. West winds 10 to 15 mph with gusts up to 25 mph.; Tuesday Night - Mostly clear. Lows in the upper 20s. Northwest winds 5 to 10 (1 more message)

03:47 <CoderForLife> &more

03:47 <Romulus> CoderForLife: mph with gusts up to 20 mph.;

03:51 <CoderForLife> plink 218.94.135.228

04:09 <mweltin> ok I'm back what did I miss

04:10 * CoderForLife looks around

04:10 <CoderForLife> let's see - I checked the weather...

04:11 <CoderForLife> and I said "plink 218.94.135.228"

04:11 * CoderForLife counts

04:11 <CoderForLife> yup - that's it

04:11 <mweltin> 37 degrees mmmmmmmm

04:11 <mweltin> nice

04:11 <mweltin> shall we check my weather

04:12 <mweltin> &weather 96799

04:12 <Romulus> mweltin: Temperature: 73F / 23C | Humidity: 78% | Pressure: 30.04in / 1017hPa | Conditions: Mostly Cloudy | Wind Direction: Variable | Wind Speed: 4mph / 6km/h ; Today - Occasional showers with isolated thunderstorms. Highs in the mid 80s. Variable winds 10 mph...with higher gusts in showers.; Tonight and Thursday - Scattered showers with isolated thunderstorms. Lows near 80. High near 90. Variable winds 10 (1 more message)

04:12 <CoderForLife> ugh 73F  =)

04:12 <mweltin> LOL and I'm goign diving tomorrow.

04:12 <mweltin> life is good

04:12 <mweltin> now if I can just get a job.

04:12 <CoderForLife> you went diving over the weekend

04:12 <mweltin> got all the tweaks worked out on the TSP too.

04:13 <mweltin> I'm even cleaning up code.

04:13 <CoderForLife> turning code into Code?

04:15 <mweltin> i go diving every chance I get.

04:16 <mweltin> I have standing dives on Tuesday and Sunday

04:17 <mweltin> and then I hang out with the NPS guy so he takes me out in their boat from time to time.

04:18 <mweltin> the code thing is just my header files included other header files.

04:18 <mweltin> I don't like that

04:19 *** mweltin is now known as mwaway

04:19 *** mwaway is now known as deathspice

04:19 <CoderForLife> bye

04:19 *** deathspice is now known as mweltin

04:19 <CoderForLife> or not

04:20 <mweltin> no i was having trouble chaning my nic

04:20 <mweltin> I was using the wrong command

04:20 <mweltin> I'm trying xchat cause I never read the man page for irssi

04:21 <CoderForLife> hmm

04:21 <mweltin> I started getting hit with spammers today

04:21 <mweltin> yoyo was nice enough to point that out

04:21 <mweltin> gave me a handy query to find them as well.

04:21 * CoderForLife checks spam rate

04:22 <CoderForLife> 98.1%

04:23 <mweltin> what is spam rate?

04:23 <mweltin> how fast its growing

04:23 <CoderForLife> about normal, but total spam is down to about 1/4 what it was a year ago

04:24 <CoderForLife> I run a greylisting milter in sendmail

04:24 <mweltin> filter ?

04:25 <CoderForLife> it has whitelisted 80 senders out of it's current list of 4346 attempted senders

04:25 <CoderForLife> um, milter

04:25 <efc> moo cfl

04:25 <CoderForLife> hello E-man

04:25 <mweltin> E nice to see you

04:26 <CoderForLife> I think this may be what I'm running - but you'll get the idea  http://hcpnet.free.fr/milter-greylist/

04:26 <Romulus> Title: milter-greylist home page (at hcpnet.free.fr)

04:28 <mweltin> one of the advisors for the rocket club I worked on was writting a AI mail filter

04:29 <CoderForLife> yep

04:30 <mweltin> I'm not sure I get how it works.

04:30 <CoderForLife> the milter seems to be some of the hardest working code on my system

04:31 <CoderForLife> more here -->  http://greylisting.org/articles/whitepaper.shtml

04:31 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/1CgS> (at greylisting.org)

04:31 <mweltin> it assumes that spammers will be blacklisted ?

04:31 <mweltin> ok

04:32 <efc> August 4, 1997. procmail becomes self aware. It begins to filter spam at a geometric rate.

04:32 <CoderForLife> read further down - "The Greylisting Method"

04:32 <mweltin> LOL

04:37 <mweltin> so the idea is based on the fire-and-forget, spammers are not going to retry sending mail.

04:37 <CoderForLife> my milter-greylist database currently has 4348 records in it, of which 80 are whitelisted

04:37 <CoderForLife> right-o

04:38 <CoderForLife> so in my case, there are 4268 triplets in the database, where the sender never came back

04:38 <mweltin> wow

04:38 <mweltin> so that is at least that many messages as well.

04:39 <CoderForLife> right - minimum

04:39 <CoderForLife> that 4268 spam messages that never got into my subsequent filters

04:40 <CoderForLife> when I first put it in, the count was usually about 12,000

04:40 <mweltin> so after a triplet is in the database is all mail from that triplet dropped?

04:41 <mweltin> I don't get how the assume there are no false positives.

04:41 <CoderForLife> each new triplet gets added to the database

04:41 <mweltin> so what happens if you get a messsage from one of those triplets?

04:42 <CoderForLife> the message from the new triplet is immediately refused - "come back later"

04:42 <mweltin> yes i understand that part

04:42 <CoderForLife> if the same triplet is seen later after the minimum time period, it gets whitelisted

04:43 <CoderForLife> the database keeps track of triplets and when they were last seen

04:43 <CoderForLife> if the sender tries again too soon, they get "come back later"

04:43 <mweltin> the database is all in memory, it seems useful for a dedicated mail server, but not a workstation

04:44 <CoderForLife> sure - this is a sendmail milter

04:45 <CoderForLife> this is not a workstation piece of code

04:45 <CoderForLife> I've run my own mail server for years

04:45 <mweltin> well I mean workstation in the sense that my laptop runs sendmail, but  don't consider it a mail server.

04:46 <mweltin> this is cool, never heard of it.

04:46 <mweltin> thanks for the eye opener

04:46 <CoderForLife> anyway... now you have, and it is interesting

04:46 <CoderForLife> and effective

04:51 <CoderForLife> &dict skulker

04:51 <Romulus> CoderForLife: wn, jargon, gcide, and foldoc responded: foldoc: skulker {prowler}; jargon: skulker n. Syn. {prowler}; gcide: Skulk \Skulk\, Skulker \Skulk"er\, n. One who, or that which, skulks. [1913 Webster]; wn: skulker n 1: someone shirking their duty by feigning illness or incapacity [syn: {malingerer}, {shammer}] 2: someone waiting in concealment [syn: {lurker}, {lurcher}]

04:51 <CoderForLife> &urbandict skulker

04:51 <Romulus> CoderForLife: Error: You must have a free UrbanDictionary API license key in order to use this command.  You can get one at <http://www.urbandictionary.com/api.php>.  Once you have one, you can set it with the command "config supybot.plugins.UrbanDict.licenseKey <key>".

04:51 <CoderForLife> oops - urbandict is broken

04:52 <mweltin> oh I thought each person needed a key

04:52 <CoderForLife> Rommie needs the key, I believe

04:52 <mweltin> thta makes more sense

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04:53 <CoderForLife> here's trouble

04:54 <Tidus> lol?

04:54 <CoderForLife> oh, you thought I meant *you*

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04:54 <CoderForLife> it's not all about you  =)

04:55 <Tidus> ... ok?

04:55 <CoderForLife> morning Tidus =)

04:56 <CoderForLife> I'll be quiet now

04:56 <Tidus> lol.  how's it going ?

04:56 <mweltin> do either of you do much with MSVS?

04:57 <CoderForLife> fine fine - I'm sitting here hating the idea of getting ready and going to w@#%

04:57 <mweltin> you are just going to work?

04:57 <mweltin> its 73 degrees and it almost 11pm here

04:57 <CoderForLife> 5:00am

04:57 <Tidus> it's 4am here

04:57 <mweltin> WHAT?!

04:58 <Tidus> &weather 72764

04:58 <Romulus> Tidus: Temperature: 26.8F / -2.9C | Humidity: 90% | Pressure: 30.38in / 1028.7hPa | Conditions: Clear | Wind Direction: NNW | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Today - Sunny. Patchy fog in the morning. Highs in the upper 50s. Light winds becoming south around 10 mph in the afternoon.; Tonight - Mostly clear. Lows in the upper 30s. South winds 10 to 20 mph.; Wednesday - Partly cloudy in the morning then becoming (1 more message)

04:58 <Tidus> Tue Nov 27 03:58:12 EST 2007

04:58 <mweltin> 26 hahahahaha LOL hahahahaha

04:58 <mweltin> thats funny

04:58 <Tidus> and that EST is wrong

04:58 <Tidus> should be CST

04:58 <CoderForLife> I'm on EST

04:58 <mweltin> I'm on sst but  I don't know what it stands for.

04:59 <Tidus> where are you located?

04:59 <mweltin> American Samoa

04:59 <Tidus> Samoan Standard Time ?

04:59 <CoderForLife> SST=supersonic transport

04:59 <mweltin> there is nothing supersonic about this island.

05:00 <mweltin> the one road, 25mph

05:00 <CoderForLife> you need one to get there

05:00 <Tidus> mweltin: i'm in the continental US

05:00 <mweltin> I figured so with the EST and all

05:01 <mweltin> how do you get up so early?

05:01 <mweltin> or did you not go to bed?

05:01 <Tidus> or rather how do i stay up so late?

05:01 <Tidus> i work a night job

05:01 <Tidus> always have

05:02 <mweltin> ahhh I worked third for a two years.

05:02 <Tidus> mine's 4pm to 1am

05:02 <mweltin> I worked in a powder coating factory.

05:02 <mweltin> thats strange second shift

05:02 <mweltin> I worked 11pm to 7am

05:03 <mweltin> the best shift was the shift before mine.

05:03 <mweltin> getting out at 11pm is not bad

05:03 <mweltin> you can still have a life.

05:06 <CoderForLife> gots lots to do - I guess I'll get started

05:06 <CoderForLife> cya folks later

05:07 * CoderForLife sees he's already "away"

05:07 <mweltin> yeah thanks for the tip

05:07 <mweltin> later

05:07 <CoderForLife> np - glad to help

05:07 <Tidus> lol seeya CFL

05:07 * CoderForLife disappears in a cloud of greasy black smoke

05:08 * Tidus coughs... "Get a tune up!"

05:10 <quail> g'evening all, how are we all?

05:11 <mweltin> quail

05:11 <mweltin> you are here again

05:11 <mweltin> honestly don't you have anywhere better to go?  I mean me I'm stuck here can't leave going nuts just thinking about it.

05:12 <Tidus> howdy quail

05:13 <mweltin> std, a namespace with this name does not exist ?!?!!?

05:13 <mweltin> that was an error message from MSVS

05:13 <quail> mweltin: I am here there and everywhere with my laptop and ssh home and reconnect to my screen session and here I am

05:13 <mweltin> what are you supposed to do about thta.

05:13 <quail> Tidus: how are you?

05:15 <Tidus> tired...

05:15 <Tidus> lol

05:15 <quail> ;-(

05:19 <mweltin> how can the standard name space not exist

05:29 <mweltin> this is the most f'ed up crap

05:29 <mweltin> for me to use

05:30 <mweltin> using namespace std;

05:30 <mweltin> I have to inlucde a stream class header file

05:30 <mweltin> doesn't matter which one

05:30 <mweltin> iostream, sstream, fstream, or even sting

05:30 <mweltin> how does ms stay in business.

05:31 <Tidus> mweltin: if i remember right... back when i was taking a C++ class, using gcc of course, we still had to #include <iostream> ...

05:33 <mweltin> before you called using?  with gcc you can put it anywhere, hell it can be the first line if you want.

05:33 <mweltin> you dont' even have to use the namespace if you don't want to.

05:33 <mweltin> but I digress

05:33 <mweltin> I'm just pissed that its taken two nights and I'm no where closer to getting it to compile.

05:34 <Tidus> mweltin: i think we had to do it before 'using namespace std;' ...

05:34 <mweltin> ok, I'm better now

05:45 <mweltin> I'm down to 120 errors

05:45 <mweltin> which is down from 900+ from last night

05:45 <mweltin> I'm doing better

06:13 <mweltin> I'm a am so smart s-a-m-r-t lalalala

06:14 <mweltin> got it to build in MSVS

06:14 <mweltin> later

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06:31 <MTughan> And I'm off to school...

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06:32 <hawmps> 'lo

06:38 * CoderForLife looks in from afar

06:38 <CoderForLife> morning hawmps

06:39 * CoderForLife disconnects from home and goes back to w@#%ing for the man

06:40 <PriitM> hehe, i belive i should upload some results :) http://priitm.planet.ee/1/seti.png

06:42 <PriitM> darn, i just got bunch of 7 hour wus

06:51 <hawmps> lol

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10:01 <hawmps> 'lo BB

10:12 <BadBarbarian> lo hawmps

10:12 <BadBarbarian> &weather 86023

10:12 <Romulus> BadBarbarian: Temperature: 16F / -9C | Humidity: 47% | Pressure: 30.38in / 1029hPa | Conditions: Clear | Wind Direction: North | Wind Speed: 0mph / 0km/h ; Today - Partly cloudy in the morning then becoming mostly cloudy. Highs around 46 on the North Rim to around 69 along the Colorado River. Light winds becoming southwest around 15 mph in the afternoon.; Tonight - Partly cloudy. Lows around 18 on the North (1 more message)

10:12 <BadBarbarian> &more

10:12 <Romulus> BadBarbarian: Rim to around 40 along the Colorado River. Light winds.; Wednesday - Mostly sunny. Highs around 45 on the North Rim to around 66 along the Colorado River. Light winds becoming northeast around 15 mph in the afternoon.;

10:14 <Tank_Master> &weather 97007

10:14 <Tank_Master> &more

10:14 <Romulus> Tank_Master: Temperature: 37.7F / 3.2C | Humidity: 88% | Pressure: 30.26in / 1024.6hPa | Conditions: Mostly Cloudy | Wind Direction: SE | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Today - Mostly cloudy. Patchy fog in the morning. Fog locally dense early especially near Hillsboro with visibility one quarter mile at times. Showers likely in the morning...then a chance of showers in the afternoon. Highs around 45. West (1 more message)

10:14 <Romulus> Tank_Master: wind 5 to 10 mph.; Tonight - Partly cloudy with a slight chance of showers. Areas of fog after midnight. Lows 30 to 35. Northwest wind 5 to 10 mph becoming light after midnight.; Wednesday - Cloudy. Areas of fog in the morning. A chance of rain in the afternoon. Highs around 40. Southeast wind 5 to 10 mph.;

10:15 <BadBarbarian> morning tank

10:15 <Tank_Master> mornin

10:15 <hawmps> pacific-north-wet

10:15 <Tank_Master> first rain we have had in a month

10:16 <Tank_Master> and it wasnt much

10:16 <BadBarbarian> wish we had some

10:16 <Tank_Master> but its currently 32 out, not 37

10:16 <hawmps> we got over an inch last night

10:16 <BadBarbarian> not one drop of rain in 6 months here

10:16 <Tank_Master> so yeah... ice on the road

10:18 <BadBarbarian> theres not even enough humity here to show frost on the cars

10:18 <hawmps> 3.37" for the month so far - usually get about 5" total for november

10:18 <Tank_Master> lol

10:18 <Tank_Master> we have less than an inch, usually 6"

10:19 <BadBarbarian> oh buy the way happy holidays every one

10:26 <hawmps> yeah, all that too...

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10:27 <hawmps> bbiab... going to try an FC8 upgrade..

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13:05 <Tank_Master> mw!

13:07 <mweltin> Tank_Master!

13:07 <Tank_Master> :) sup?

13:07 <mweltin> got my msvs stuff worked out last night

13:07 <Tank_Master> sweet!

13:08 <mweltin> i find it ironic you work for sun in one of the rainest places in the US.

13:08 <Tank_Master> not me

13:08 <Tank_Master> zombie

13:08 <Tank_Master> he's in CA

13:08 <mweltin> you guys look alike to me

13:08 <Tank_Master> :P

13:09 <mweltin> yeah your a school admin

13:09 <mweltin> I forget a lot

13:09 <Tank_Master> cept mine is longer, his has numbers, mine has an underscore...

13:09 <mweltin> misspent youth

13:09 <Tank_Master> something like that

13:09 <Tank_Master> :)

13:09 <Tank_Master> we are torturing kids

13:10 <mweltin> gotta run, GF has to go to work, if I want the car I have to bring her in.

13:10 <Tank_Master> ok

13:10 *** mweltin is now known as mw_away

13:10 <Tank_Master> hf ;)

13:11 <mw_away> thanks

13:11 <rubiks120> Hi Tank

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13:12 <Tank_Master> hey

13:12 <rubiks120> hows it going?

13:12 <Tank_Master> not bad

13:13 <Tank_Master> trying to get my team into the WCG xmas race...

13:13 <Tank_Master> think they are interested, now we just need to find the founder for WCG...

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13:13 <rubiks120> good luck with that, Im emailing one of my professors I sort of slept through class this morning

13:13 <Tank_Master> LOL

13:14 <Tank_Master> been there, done that

13:15 <rubiks120> yea, it was one of those mornings nothing got me out of bed

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13:16 <Tank_Master> sup E?

13:16 <Tank_Master> we had ice on the roads this morning

13:16 <E-30> wow fun

13:17 <Tank_Master> :)

13:17 <Tank_Master> made things interesting

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13:17 <E-30> i see

13:17 <Tank_Master> and a great excuse to leave late and sleep in a touch more

13:17 <rubiks120> haha

13:17 <Tank_Master> yo yoyo!

13:17 <E-30> haha

13:18 <yoyo[RKN]> hi

13:18 <Tank_Master> hows life?

13:18 <E-30> wow hes back

13:18 <Tank_Master> hehe

13:18 <Tank_Master> gluten for punishment

13:18 <yoyo[RKN]> yeah

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13:22 <Tank_Master> wb

13:23 <rubiks120> ty, switched to gnome, still havent completely settled on a desktop environment yet

13:23 <Tank_Master> ahh

13:23 <Tank_Master> I prefer the vista envirnment

13:24 <rubiks120> I was using enligthenment but its giving me some issues

13:24 <rubiks120> so now Im back in gnome

13:25 <Tank_Master> cool

13:26 <yoyo[RKN]> brb

13:26 <rubiks120> yea, there some things I can just never make up my mind with

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13:26 <Tank_Master> :D

13:26 <rubiks120> but I tend to be a fan of dual monitors, and on my current vid card, gnome doesnt work well in a dual monitor environemnt

13:26 <Tank_Master> yo! yoyo! whered yo go!?

13:27 <Tank_Master> huh

13:27 <Tank_Master> I have a dual display both at work and at home

13:27 <rubiks120> dual monitors is the way to go

13:28 <Tank_Master> defently

13:29 <rubiks120> specially like last night when I was reading bout the genetic algorithms and chatting here

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13:30 <Tank_Master> z!

13:30 <Tank_Master> yeah, I was doing something similer

13:31 <Tank_Master> playing a shockwave game and reading my team's board, IMing, and chatting here

13:31 <freelarry> rubiks120: how do you set up a dual monitor? do you log in as two different users each on different monitor or is it just assigning one work area to one monitor and another to the other?

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13:31 <Tank_Master> with windows, it can just streatch the desktop over the two monitors, boubeling your deaktop space

13:32 <rubiks120> freelarry, the way I was making mine work was through xrandr, an extension of the X server, its still new and there are some problems with it

13:32 <rubiks120> but the way it works is essentially take the 2 screens and turn them into 1 virtual desktop

13:32 <freelarry> k was interested as still getting pieces for next machine

13:33 <Tank_Master> if you can, I would defently go for it

13:33 <freelarry> planning on using a 27" flat panel tv as one monitor and maybe getting another flatpanel for that machine

13:33 <rubiks120> it works better with certain window managers, which is why i started using enlightenment as well as gnome

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13:34 * freelarry has to remeber to ask at stores if they have any 5.25" floppy drives laying around

13:34 <rubiks120> with e17 I can maximize apps fine on one screen or the other, with gnome it tries to use both screens when you maximize

13:34 <rubiks120> 5.25" floppys?

13:35 <freelarry> found all sorts of old disks from time in service and don't know if any still have any good programs on them

13:35 <freelarry> a fair amount of db prog

13:35 <freelarry> floppy drive needed to read them

13:35 <rubiks120> ahh ok, I would check ebay for something like that, you may have better luck

13:36 <freelarry> not many shown there either

13:36 <freelarry> may have to buy someones very old machine to get one

13:37 <freelarry> thing is the mb's still have a hookup for floppies but mostly only for 3.5" drives nowdays

13:37 <rubiks120> yea, I havent seen a 5.25" floppy since middle school I think

13:37 *** siofwolves has joined #boinc

13:38 <rubiks120> I do have an old IBM pc-convertible but that doesnt even use 5.25"

13:38 <freelarry> ohh you missed the grand ol days when programs were stored on cassette tape drives then

13:39 <E-30> i have a old win 98 box here stilll working

13:39 <rubiks120> yea, I havent been around that long even the ibm I have is older then me

13:39 <freelarry> lol

13:39 <rubiks120> im still only 19 almost to 20

13:39 <E-30> well i ahve a apple 2 + here still working

13:39 <freelarry> rapidly approaching 50

13:40 <Tank_Master> I have a compacq 64

13:40 <E-30> with smokey the bear

13:40 <freelarry> ohhh E-30 one of those monster machines i used to drool over

13:40 <Tank_Master> with a 2mb memory add-on card and a 30mb HD no less

13:40 <freelarry> dad burned up about 3 of thosse Tank_Master

13:40 <rubiks120> Ooo I remember the old Apples, I used to love the games they had on those things

13:41 <freelarry> no wait that was commador64

13:41 <rubiks120> yea, I have only read about those, never got to actually see one

13:42 <freelarry> donated one to a user group over in bremerton back in the 90's

13:42 *** TF|Gone has joined #boinc

13:42 <rubiks120> I was actually very suprised when I got the ibm, 640 kb of memory, no hdd 2 floppy drives, ran DOS 6.1 I think

13:42 *** TheFons has quit IRC

13:42 <freelarry> lots of games progamming disk and a couple of external drives for it also

13:42 <Tank_Master> I got dos 1.6

13:42 <freelarry> they ran a bb with it for a while

13:43 <rubiks120> yea, I ran bbs over it, with a little hacked up TNC

13:43 <freelarry> found part of my old win 3.1 disk also but if i remember there was some bad disk in the set

13:43 <rubiks120> worked like a charm

13:44 <rubiks120> wow windows 3.1, I had a laptop with win 3.1 on it my dad made me throw that one away though, he was getting fed up with my old computer collection

13:44 <freelarry> set of 6 3.5 disks

13:44 <rubiks120> well, I have to run to class

13:44 <freelarry> k have good time

13:44 <rubiks120> its just where I want to be =P

13:44 <Tank_Master> hf

13:45 *** rubiks120 is now known as rubiks120|afk

13:45 <freelarry> always and forever?

13:49 *** yoyo[RKN] has joined #boinc

13:55 *** E-30 has quit IRC

13:57 <Tank_Master> wn yoyo

13:57 <Tank_Master> wb*

13:59 *** yoyo_RKN has joined #boinc

14:00 *** yoyo_RKN has quit IRC

14:01 <Tank_Master> wb again yoyo

14:01 <Tank_Master> yoyo is yoyoing in n out of the room

14:02 * Tank_Master wonders if yoyo can walk the dog...

14:02 <Tank_Master> &weather 97007

14:02 <Tank_Master> &more

14:02 <Romulus> Tank_Master: Error: That's all, there is no more.

14:03 <Romulus> Tank_Master: Temperature: 47.4F / 8.6C | Humidity: 82% | Pressure: 30.37in / 1028.3hPa | Conditions: Scattered Clouds | Wind Direction: SSW | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Today - Mostly cloudy...becoming partly cloudy. Isolated showers. Highs near 45. West wind 5 to 15 mph.; Tonight - Partly cloudy. Slight chance of evening showers. Areas of fog forming after midnight. Lows 30 to 35. West wind 5 to 10 mph (1 more message)

14:03 <Tank_Master> &more

14:03 <Romulus> Tank_Master: becoming light by midnight.; Wednesday - Cloudy. Areas of morning fog. Chance of rain in the afternoon. Highs 40 to 45. Southeast wind 5 to 10 mph.;

14:06 *** yoyo_RKN has joined #boinc

14:07 <Tank_Master> now we have a double yoyo

14:07 <zombie67> yoyoyoyo?

14:08 <yoyo_RKN> yoyoyoyoyoyyooyoooyoyoo

14:08 <Tank_Master> something like that :)

14:08 <yoyo_RKN> hae problems with my DNS server

14:09 <Tank_Master> ouch

14:10 <Tank_Master> that bytes

14:11 <yoyo_RKN> if i try to open a url i get http://217.6.164.162/dns/

14:11 <Romulus> Title: Hinweis (at 217.6.164.162)

14:11 <yoyo_RKN> ;)

14:18 *** yoyo[RKN] has quit IRC

14:26 <The_XMas_Turkey> HAI GAIS

14:28 *** mw_away is now known as mwelin

14:28 <Tank_Master> wb

14:28 <mwelin> thanks

14:30 <Tank_Master> 2.15 is running faster

14:30 <Tank_Master> but 10-15min on my core2

14:30 <Tank_Master> by*

14:30 <mwelin> so now, out of 1018 results only 219 are invlaid, and at least 100 of those have 0cpu time

14:30 <Tank_Master> huh

14:30 <Tank_Master> better

14:30 <zombie67> ouch

14:31 <mwelin> make that 200

14:31 <Tank_Master> so, your going to give the ones of mine double points, right?

14:31 <mwelin> tripple

14:31 <Tank_Master> sweet!

14:31 <Tank_Master> tripple 0 = 0

14:31 * yoyo_RKN will give 4 times

14:31 <Tank_Master> LOL

14:32 * Tank_Master starts working for yoyo

14:32 <yoyo_RKN> ;)

14:32 <zombie67> whore

14:32 <mwelin> I can't compete with that

14:32 <Tank_Master> rofl

14:33 <mwelin> whore and this from the guy that drops TSP for some "new" project

14:33 <Tank_Master> wcg aint new

14:33 <Tank_Master> its one of the oldest out ther

14:33 * zombie67 is easily distracted by shiny objects

14:33 <Tank_Master> SETI, then climate, the WCG, I believe

14:33 <mwelin> so zombie67 has a thing for older projects

14:33 <Tank_Master> yes

14:34 <Tank_Master> I may be running WCG to

14:34 <Tank_Master> if I can get my team signed up...

14:34 <yoyo_RKN> does seti.usa join the wcg christmas race?

14:34 <zombie67> milkyway just a run in with massive cheating

14:34 <zombie67> quorum of 1, people claiming 700k per result

14:34 <Tank_Master> not yet

14:34 <Tank_Master> need to find the founder first

14:35 <zombie67> Team MacNN finally joined the race

14:35 <yoyo_RKN> what is the status of your poll?

14:35 <Tank_Master> only because you were handed admin

14:35 <Tank_Master> 11-10, I believe

14:35 <Tank_Master> in favor of

14:35 <Tank_Master> 11-9, sorry

14:36 <Tank_Master> would be tied if it wasnt for you and z

14:36 <Tank_Master> ;)

14:36 <yoyo_RKN> zombie67 : is it your PS3 farm ;) http://www.dbestern.com/files/IB_PS3_Pharm.JPG

14:36 <zombie67> I am secrectly working for the seti.usa opponent for the RS challenge

14:36 <Tank_Master> lol

14:37 <Tank_Master> nice ps3 rac

14:37 <zombie67> neat!  No, I have only one

14:37 <Tank_Master> thats 21k right there!

14:37 <zombie67> 7...that is a lot of heat!  those things are hot!

14:37 <Tank_Master> in more ay than one

14:37 <Tank_Master> way*

14:37 <zombie67> obviously not on the west coast.

14:38 <zombie67> just a tiny eqrthquake, and they would go tumbling donw

14:39 <Tank_Master> that was in olimpia

14:39 <Tank_Master> 4.1

14:39 <zombie67> that picture was taken in olympia?

14:40 <Tank_Master> no, someone from the west coast would have tiedowns on them

14:40 <zombie67> right

14:40 <Tank_Master> the eq was, yes

14:40 <zombie67> or lay them flat

14:40 <Tank_Master> yeah, with tiedowns on the rails on the shelving

14:44 <mwelin> what was that crazy post on hte project list about moderation?

14:45 <Tank_Master> ?

14:45 <zombie67> seti is worse than a soap opera.  just ignore

14:45 <Saenger> that's right

14:45 <mwelin> i had some trouble with a project name, and Anderson told me to not spend more than 1% of your time on that kind of stuff.

14:45 <mwelin> I read about half of it and thought well thats my 1%

14:46 <Tank_Master> LOL

14:46 <Tank_Master> good for ya

14:46 <mwelin> I feel bad for Anderson, he must get that stuff all the time.

14:47 <mwelin> brb coffee

14:47 <Tank_Master> hf

14:51 <mwelin> I think I can make TSP faster

14:51 <Tank_Master> faster is good

14:51 <mwelin> to calculate a path I sum the distance of every city connection

14:51 <Tank_Master> can you make mine faster than everyone elses?

14:52 <Tank_Master> :)

14:52 <mwelin> yes

14:52 <mwelin> but don't tell anyone

14:52 <Tank_Master> cool

14:52 <Tank_Master> ok

14:52 <Tank_Master> good thing zombie isnt watching

14:52 <Tank_Master> right z?

14:52 <mwelin> every permutation only changes 1 city

14:52 <freelarry> or reading logs

14:52 <Tank_Master> :)

14:52 <Tank_Master> logs?

14:52 <freelarry> this channel has logs

14:53 <Tank_Master> I like to split my logs into sections

14:53 <mwelin> so realy there hsould be only a one subraction and one addition operation

14:53 <Tank_Master> easier to burn that way

14:53 <mwelin> or every path length calcuation after the first one.

14:53 * freelarry hd's smell when burning

14:53 <zombie67> *snark*  wha?

14:53 <Tank_Master> you sure its the hd?

14:53 <Tank_Master> LOL

14:53 <Tank_Master> hi Z

14:54 <mwelin> "it tastes like burning" -ralph wiggim

14:56 <zombie67> 'What smells like blue?' - Fry

14:58 <freelarry> cleaning of comp rooms?

14:58 <freelarry> with microwave vacuum

15:07 *** PovAddict has left #boinc

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15:11 *** sokrat3s is now known as sokr4t3s

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15:24 <mwelin> what do you think my chances are asking people to hire me to set up a project?

15:25 <Tank_Master> depends on if you can get your own project working in top notch ;)

15:26 <mwelin> its working

15:26 <mwelin> fake till ya make it

15:26 <Tank_Master> probably a good chance though

15:26 <mwelin> I'm drafting two letters now

15:26 <Tank_Master> just hope you dont go the way of gridfinity

15:26 <mwelin> one to primary investigators and one to admins (deans and what not)

15:26 <mwelin> what happened to them?

15:27 <Tank_Master> dunno

15:27 <mwelin> oh

15:27 <mwelin> I see, yes I hope that does not happen to me.

15:27 <Tank_Master> the admin one day just stoped all work on the project and never powsted anything on the site

15:27 <mwelin> If it does my mom and dad live in Vermont

15:27 <mwelin> let them know will you

15:27 <Tank_Master> the website is still there and functional, just not getting updated

15:28 <Tank_Master> I take it you know which projetc Im talking about

15:28 <Tank_Master> would helped me out alot with all these comps I have at work

15:41 *** bryanUC has quit IRC

15:41 <mwelin> i don't know about the project no.

15:42 <PriitM> uh oh

15:42 <PriitM> Seti is down :<

15:43 <mwelin> and like sand through an hour glass so are the seti's of our lives.

15:48 <Tank_Master> you meen SETI has been up?

15:48 <PriitM> right..

15:48 <Tank_Master> :)

15:49 <PriitM> i thought that downtime is going to be on 29th

15:49 <Tank_Master> its tuesday

15:49 <Tank_Master> they always go down on tuesday

15:49 <PriitM> oh

15:49 <Tank_Master> for backup and to reboot stuff

15:49 <PriitM> I didn't knew it, was away from SETI for almoust a year and now came back

15:50 <Tank_Master> ahh

15:50 <Tank_Master> lol

15:50 <Tank_Master> I havent gone back yet

15:50 <Tank_Master> been waya for a year to

15:50 <Tank_Master> away*

15:50 <PriitM> 32 000 credits with 1 PC :P

15:50 <Tank_Master> not bac

15:51 <Tank_Master> bad*

15:51 <PriitM> 24/7 in winter time

15:51 <PriitM> 100% cpu time

15:51 <PriitM> I got bad windows, so I use comp to warm the room :>

16:07 * freelarry currently uses his small collection to help warm the basement

16:09 *** yoyo_RKN has quit IRC

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16:10 <mwelin> hey yoyo

16:11 <yoyo[RKN]> jojo

16:15 <sokr4t3s> its exciting to see uppercase run smoothly on a newly configured boinc server vm :)

16:16 <yoyo[RKN]> hehe

16:16 <yoyo[RKN]> can I attach to your uppercase

16:17 <sokr4t3s> no way its on private lan ^^

16:17 <sokr4t3s> much better research than rosetta and the other stuff - much too complex -  this is simple as hell

16:18 <yoyo[RKN]> yes

16:18 <xcamel> re-hi

16:18 <yoyo[RKN]> how long is your uppercase workunit

16:19 <sokr4t3s> the default i think

16:19 <yoyo[RKN]> as I remember uppercase has a command sitch to set the runtime. Something like -cpu 10

16:22 <sokr4t3s> where can i see how it is configured?

16:25 *** MTughan has joined #boinc

16:25 <MTughan> Well, my Mac's on the fritz...

16:26 <mwelin> NO!

16:26 <MTughan> mwelin?

16:26 <mwelin> you are my only mac developer.

16:26 *** mwelin is now known as mweltin

16:26 <MTughan> Oh, I just need to reinstall OS X. That can be done within a day.

16:26 <mweltin> it was a late night last night

16:26 <mweltin> I got MSVS working

16:26 <MTughan> Cool.

16:26 <mweltin> I can now compile my own windows aps.

16:27 <yoyo[RKN]> sokr4t3s : you see it in the uppercase source code

16:27 <MTughan> That works with me.

16:27 <yoyo[RKN]> MTughan : do you have ppc or intel mac

16:27 <MTughan> yoyo[RKN]: I have an Intel Mac.

16:28 <sokr4t3s> cool; just saw the source code of uc; really simple - thought of a dozen files ^^

16:29 <MTughan> Okay, anyone remember how to configure how XChat looks?

16:30 <yoyo[RKN]> MTughan : can you test a application for me if its starts?

16:30 <MTughan> Doesn't seem to be in Edit->Preferences...

16:30 <MTughan> yoyo[RKN]: I can't even boot the machine at the moment, except for single-user mode.

16:30 <yoyo[RKN]> ok

16:30 <mweltin> settings-> pref

16:31 <MTughan> I've got to make a backup of my stuff, then reinstall OS X.

16:31 <MTughan> Hmm... GNOME frontend must be different than the KDE version.

16:32 <MTughan> Okay, brb, gonna switch to KDE.

16:32 *** MTughan has quit IRC

16:32 <xcamel> wazzup?

16:33 *** MTughan has joined #boinc

16:34 <MTughan> Okay, KDE looks a lot better.

16:36 <MTughan> Hmm... Beryl seemed to make XChat transparent...

16:37 <MTughan> Ah, that's nicer. I like Compiz Fusion better than Beryl.

16:37 <xcamel> Compiz Fusion is much better

16:37 * xcamel loves it

16:37 <MTughan> Yeah.

16:37 <MTughan> lol

16:38 <mweltin> what is it?

16:38 <xcamel> good screen candy is hard to find

16:38 <MTughan> I don't remember... Do emoticons work? :)

16:38 <MTughan> Nope.

16:38 <mweltin> I just made my back groud black and I'm happy to hvae that.

16:38 <xcamel> OpenGL screen candy for KDE

16:38 <mweltin> I hate the default white screen.

16:38 <mweltin> ahh

16:38 <xcamel> in 3D

16:38 <mweltin> I like fluxbox

16:39 <mweltin> simple

16:39 <mweltin> small

16:39 <MTughan> http://michaelsprogramming.home.dyndns.org/Cube.png One thing I've done with it.

16:39 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/11TV> (at michaelsprogramming.home.dyndns.org)

16:39 <mweltin> no eye candy though

16:39 *** blendtux has joined #boinc

16:40 <mweltin> i got a movie as my wallpaper once

16:40 <mweltin> I forgot how I did it.

16:40 *** yoyo[RKN] has quit IRC

16:40 <mweltin> some funky redirect or screen option to mplayer

16:41 <mweltin> it was cool for about 10 min

16:41 <MTughan> Actually... http://michaelsprogramming.home.dyndns.org/Cube2.png is what it looks like right now.

16:41 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/14W3> (at michaelsprogramming.home.dyndns.org)

16:42 <mweltin> oh

16:42 <MTughan> The other one was an earlier test, with Beryl I think.

16:42 <mweltin> much different

16:42 <MTughan> That's with Compiz Fusion.

16:43 <MTughan> Anyway, I'm going to go up and attempt to get my Mac working again... If you get any new builds that need to be rushed out, I should be able to build it from single-user mode.

16:44 <mweltin> no, we are good for onw

16:44 <MTughan> Okay.

16:47 *** blendtux has left #boinc

17:00 <mweltin> ok lunch

17:00 <mweltin> taek it easy guys

17:00 *** mweltin has quit IRC

17:00 *** mweltin has joined #boinc

17:00 <mweltin> no really

17:01 <mweltin> I'm outta here

17:01 *** mweltin has quit IRC

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17:28 *** siof is now known as siofwolves

17:33 <Tank_Master> lunch sounds good

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17:40 *** PovAdct_v2 has joined #boinc

17:40 <Tank_Master> PA!

17:40 <Tank_Master> buddy!

17:40 <Tank_Master> congrats on the version upgrade!!

17:40 <PovAdct_v2> wtf why isnt my v1 on the channel

17:41 <Tank_Master> it was upgraded to v2

17:41 <Tank_Master> :P, I havent a clue

17:42 <PovAdct_v2> did MTughan say he was going away?

17:43 <Tank_Master> not that I see.

17:43 <PovAdct_v2> seems he has been afk for an hour

17:44 <Tank_Master> last responce was 1 hr ago

17:45 <wdsmia> re-hi

17:45 <xcamel> 'lo Doug

17:46 <MTughan> PovAdct_v2: Here now.

17:46 <wdsmia> *lo Jay

17:46 <MTughan> 'lo Dough

17:46 <MTughan> Doug*

17:46 <PovAdct_v2> lol

17:46 <MTughan> Anyway, my Mac's on the fritz.

17:47 <MTughan> brb

17:47 <Tank_Master> hf

17:49 <MTughan> Earlier today, it was just shutting off at random, after it kernel panic'd.

17:50 <MTughan> What started the problems was I was upgrading to 10.4.11 to try and fix the problems, and it shut off again. *wince*

17:50 * Tank_Master prefers windows because its kernal never panics, it knows exactly what to do.

17:50 <MTughan> Now I can't even mount the drive...

17:50 <PovAdct_v2> Tank_Master: show a blue screen?

17:50 <MTughan> Tank_Master: BSOD = kernel panic

17:51 <Tank_Master> nope, its a driscription of the probem, not panicing

17:51 <PovAdct_v2> the BSOD is to hide the the fact that it crapped itself

17:51 <xcamel> >>

17:51 <xcamel> New Flexible, Transparent Transistors made of Nanotubes

17:52 <MTughan> So what I'm doing at the moment is doing an install to an external drive. Going to see if I can do anything more there, with lots of stuff at my disposal in terms of graphical apps.

17:52 <Tank_Master> lol, not to show that it had hadle the crap gracefully

17:52 <PovAdct_v2> kernel panics have descriptions too btw

17:52 <xcamel> http://www.physorg.com/news115382102.html

17:52 <Romulus> Title: New Flexible, Transparent Transistors made of Nanotubes (at www.physorg.com)

17:52 <PovAdct_v2> xcamel: wow

17:52 <Tank_Master> sweet, xcam

17:53 <MTughan> Looks cool...

17:59 <PovAdct_v2> &ping

17:59 <Romulus> pong

18:00 <MTughan> PovAdct_v2, did you ever see my Makefile?

18:00 <MTughan> For TSP, that is.

18:01 <MTughan> Because if I needed just one thing back right away, it'd be that.

18:02 <PovAdct_v2> I'm not @home

18:02 <MTughan> Do you remember ever seeing it though?

18:02 <PovAdct_v2> hmm nope

18:02 <MTughan> All right... I'm sure mweltin didn't see it either, so I'll probably have to remake it.

18:03 * MTughan grumbles

18:03 <PovAdct_v2> you should have put it on svn (under a different name, not overwriting the Makefile)

18:04 *** siofwolves has quit IRC

18:04 *** Saenger has quit IRC

18:04 <PovAdct_v2> do you remember putting it on a pastebin?

18:06 * PovAdct_v2 mentions MTughan to flash his IRC window

18:09 *** PovAdct_v2 has quit IRC

18:10 <MTughan> I don't think I ever put it up on a pastebin either... Not that he can see that now. :P

18:11 <MTughan> Off to dinner...

18:16 <rubiks120|afk> Hey guys

18:16 *** rubiks120|afk is now known as rubiks120

18:19 <xcamel> 'lo

18:20 <xcamel> for a second I thought xmas_turkey was TGG in disguise...

18:21 <wdsmia> lol

18:21 <xcamel> what ever happened to Paul anyway?

18:21 <xcamel> did Oz float away?

18:21 <rubiks120> I couldnt tell ya

18:21 <rubiks120> I cant say I know who paul is

18:22 <xcamel> &seen TheGasGiant

18:22 <Romulus> xcamel: TheGasGiant was last seen in #boinc 3 weeks, 2 days, 17 hours, 10 minutes, and 52 seconds ago: <TheGasGiant> &bye freelarry

18:22 <xcamel> hmmmm...

18:22 <wdsmia> Its spring down there so he must be out and about

18:22 <xcamel> possibly...

18:39 <CoderForLife> hello

18:40 <MTughan> 'lo CFL

18:40 <wdsmia> *lo Don

18:40 <PriitM> k

18:40 <MTughan> I like loud music... :P

18:40 <CoderForLife> hello Doug =)

18:41 <CoderForLife> hello Michael

18:41 <CoderForLife> =) to you too

18:41 <MTughan> And I think it's only at half volume right now... xD

18:41 <CoderForLife> k PriitM

18:42 <PriitM> k CoderForLife

18:42 * CoderForLife wonders if that's "moo" in some language

18:42 <MTughan> lol

18:42 <MTughan> apt-get moo xD

18:42 <MTughan> That one never gets old in my eyes...

18:42 <CoderForLife> Multi-user Object Oblivion

18:43 <xcamel> 'lo Don

18:44 <PriitM> ah yes, someone is selling ibm t30 with 2Gb processor :>

18:44 <MTughan> lol

18:45 <PriitM> oh, here's even better one

18:45 <PriitM> p3 600mhz pc for 250$

18:46 <wdsmia> I have a old 486 33mhz in the closet want to make a bid... LOL

18:46 <PriitM> i got media center sitting under tv for few years now

18:47 <PriitM> bought in 2005 Dec, total uptime 40 days

18:47 <PriitM> wanna buy?

18:47 <PriitM> :-p

18:48 <MTughan> lol

18:48 <MTughan> I'm on a three year old P4 system, made myself. Still going strong.

18:49 <PriitM> i got year old amd x2 system

18:49 <PriitM> still works like a charm

18:49 <MTughan> Runs Vista Aero and Compiz Fusion with ease.

18:49 <PriitM> runs ubuntu 7.04 gnome w/o any effects very nicely

18:50 <MTughan> FC7 here.

18:50 <MTughan> GNOME and KDE.

18:50 <PriitM> i used debian for a while,  but it was still bit too complicated for my nub skillz :<

18:51 <MTughan> Hey, you have Ubuntu... Type "apt-get moo" in a command prompt. :P

18:51 <PriitM> right..

18:52 <PriitM> yesterday i had kinda sad but fun issue

18:52 <MTughan> Did you run it?

18:53 <PriitM> nope :<

18:53 <PriitM> i  belive it draws picture of cow as ASCII art?

18:53 <MTughan> It's not going to hurt anything. apt-get is an installer, and you the syntax is apt-get install <package name>. apt-get moo is an easter egg.

18:53 <MTughan> lol, yeah. xD

18:53 <PriitM> anyways

18:53 <PriitM> there was one really annoying and bitchy kid on our local linux usergroup channel

18:54 <xcamel> only one?

18:54 <PriitM> yeah

18:54 <xcamel> that's rare

18:54 <PriitM> someone gave him command of: /dev/random > /dev/sda or similar

18:54 <MTughan> If you type apt-get by itself, it prints out the help, then "This cow has super powers" or something to that effect.

18:54 <MTughan> lol

18:54 <PriitM> and he ran it in root console =/

18:55 <MTughan> He did?

18:55 <MTughan> rofl

18:55 <xcamel> ouchies..

18:55 <MTughan> That must be even worse than "rm -rf /"...

18:55 <PriitM> his box didn't boot up after rebooting so he booted up with livecd and started whining about the porn

18:56 <PriitM> 'all the porn, all the projects; my rpg!!one!!shift!11!'

18:56 <MTughan> ...

18:56 <xcamel> he'll get over it..

18:56 <MTughan> We hope.

18:57 <MTughan> Or maybe not...

18:57 <PriitM> yeah, he did

18:57 <MTughan> :(

18:57 <PriitM> next day he came back and started asking for help to install java

18:57 <MTughan> Idiot...

18:57 <PriitM> he was silly noob

18:58 <PriitM> i'm looking forward to meet him again :)

18:59 <MTughan> You have something planned?

18:59 <MTughan> >:)

19:00 <PriitM> i gave few other guys idea of creating some shell scripts

19:00 <PriitM> wget and ./

19:00 <PriitM> :)

19:01 <PriitM> anyways good night, i need to sleep a bit

19:02 <MTughan> Bye.

19:04 <MTughan> brb

19:06 <wdsmia> Jay... looks like your cranking up the volume on abc

19:10 *** mweltin has joined #boinc

19:15 <xcamel> a bit..

19:18 <wdsmia> well after i hit the 1M point at qmc I will have to do somthing about that lol

19:21 <MTughan> mweltin: You make the Linux apps for TSP, right?

19:21 <mweltin> the 32bit ones yes.

19:22 <MTughan> Heh. I was thinking of building them myself when I booted this up, but you've got it covered.

19:22 <MTughan> Hey, did you ever see my Makefile?

19:22 <mweltin> no

19:22 <mweltin> did you put it in svn ?

19:22 <Soul_keeper> hello

19:23 <MTughan> No, and I regret that now...

19:23 <MTughan> The only thing I uploaded to SVN was the tabbing in bruteForce.cpp.

19:23 <mweltin> sorry, maybe its time for Makefile.am

19:24 <mweltin> and start using gnu builds.

19:24 <wdsmia> wow im cooking at tsp total 70 and rac of 3 ROFL

19:24 <mweltin> tabbing?

19:24 <MTughan> Anyway, I can't seem to read the old drive in my Mac. But I'm still going to try...

19:24 *** efc has joined #boinc

19:24 <MTughan> 'lo e

19:24 <mweltin> thanks wdsmia

19:24 <MTughan> mweltin: Yeah, the tabs were off, remember?

19:24 <mweltin> hey efc

19:24 <efc> hey

19:25 <wdsmia> *lo e

19:30 <wdsmia> mweltin when your project has a rac index of 10+ your not going to get much of my cpu time... sorry

19:32 <mweltin> translation please?

19:32 <mweltin> what is my rac index?

19:37 <CoderForLife> re-hey

19:38 <wdsmia> its something us credit whores use.... take the adv time and adv credit for a project and divide to find out adv time per credit

19:39 <mweltin> what is a good rac index

19:39 <CoderForLife> I'm off (waaaay off) for the evening

19:39 <mweltin> or one that will keep you at tsp?

19:39 <mweltin> bye cfl

19:39 <CoderForLife> cya

19:39 <wdsmia> cya Don

19:42 <wdsmia> example on this box... qmc 2.72 abc 3.10 seti beta 3.22

19:42 <mweltin> what are the units

19:42 <mweltin> min/credit

19:42 <wdsmia> 2.72 min per credit

19:43 <mweltin> and mine is a 10 +

19:44 <wdsmia> its the lousy *nix boxes killing it

19:44 <wdsmia> :)

19:44 <xcamel> I resemble that remark...

19:44 <wdsmia> http://bob.myisland.as/tsp/workunit.php?wuid=179647

19:44 <mweltin> waht do you mean?

19:44 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/1Cxb> (at bob.myisland.as)

19:45 <mweltin> their average credit granted is too low.

19:45 <mweltin> when I move to a fixed credit I hope you give it another chance.

19:46 <wdsmia> Im allways happy to help out and test apps

19:47 <MTughan> mweltin: If I'm getting undefined references errors about your classes, it means that it can't find the definitions, the compiled versions, right?

19:47 <MTughan> I guess I should link against BOINC and expat too... :P

19:48 <mweltin> yeah that would help

19:48 <mweltin> turns out that was my problem last night

19:48 <MTughan> lol

19:48 <mweltin> I had some option that was liking agains Mtd whatever that is.

19:49 <MTughan> I was forgetting the -lboinc -lboinc_api -lexpat

19:49 <mweltin> and the libexpthMT was what I was linking in.

19:49 <mweltin> so I swithced that to MT and it built like butter

19:49 <MTughan> Like butter? lol

19:50 *** zombie67 has joined #boinc

19:50 *** mweltin has quit IRC

19:50 <MTughan> 'lo zombie

19:50 <zombie67> hi

19:50 <wdsmia> *lo z

19:50 <zombie67> hi

19:50 <zombie67> is TM around?

19:51 <MTughan> Tank_Master, you here?

19:51 <zombie67> hmmm, guess not

19:51 <wdsmia> TM Online: 19h.37m.49s (1hr.58m.41s idle)

19:51 *** mweltin has joined #boinc

19:52 <zombie67> yeah, he stays logged on even when away

19:52 <zombie67> hi

19:52 <mweltin> I'm back

19:52 <wdsmia> wb

19:52 <mweltin> so a rac of  2 is good then?

19:52 <zombie67> never.

19:52 <MTughan> "bruteForce.cpp:(.text+0x123): undefined reference to `MFILE::flush()'"

19:52 <zombie67> follow that with 4 or 5 0's

19:53 <MTughan> lol

19:53 <wdsmia> rofl

19:53 <zombie67> okay, i'll check back in later.  take it easy guys!

19:53 <MTughan> Bye.

19:53 *** zombie67 has left #boinc

19:54 <wdsmia> rac index of 2 is fantastic

19:54 <mweltin> are you srure boinc is linking correctly?

19:54 <MTughan> -lboinc, no errors about it.

19:55 <mweltin> in gcc the order they appear in the link line makes a difference

19:55 <MTughan> It's -lboinc -lboinc_api -lexpat

19:55 <mweltin> try making the api first

19:55 <mweltin> how is it in my make file

19:56 <MTughan> I don't know, I'm making my own.

19:56 <MTughan> Same error.

19:57 <mweltin> mmmmmmm

19:57 <MTughan> You have it in that order too, along with -lpthread.

19:57 <MTughan> And since this is Linux, I should be using that too...

19:58 <MTughan> LIB = -L/boinc/lib -lboinc_api -L/boinc/lib -lboinc -L../lib $(OBJECTS) -lexpat  -lpthread

19:58 <mweltin> taht is exactly what I have

19:58 <MTughan> Yeah, that's from yours.

19:58 <mweltin> g++ -O2  -static -I/boinc/include/BOINC  -I../lib  bruteForce.cpp -L/boinc/lib -lboinc_api -L/boinc/lib -lboinc -L../lib ../lib/tspParser.o ../lib/mylib.o ../lib/random.o ../lib/CurrState.o ../lib/ParsePathDist.o ../lib/PermClass.o ../lib/Containers.o  -lexpat  -lpthread  -o tsp

19:59 <mweltin> oh

19:59 <mweltin> sorry for the big paste then

19:59 <MTughan> Mine: LIB_PATH=-L/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc/lib -L/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc/api -L/home/mtughan/boinc/expat/lib -lboinc_api -lboinc -lexpat -lpthread lib/*.o

19:59 <mweltin> you built libs first right

19:59 <MTughan> Yep, they're built. The .a's are there.

20:00 <mweltin> I mean the .o's my libs, but clearly they are

20:00 <mweltin> the only difference is the lib/*.o is last

20:00 <MTughan> What's outputted: g++ -O3 -ffast-math -I/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc -I/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc/api -I/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc/lib -I/home/mtughan/boinc/expat/include -I./lib -L/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc/lib -L/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc/api -L/home/mtughan/boinc/expat/lib -lboinc_api -lboinc -lexpat -lpthread lib/*.o -o build/tsp BruteForce/bruteForce.cpp

20:01 <mweltin> I hvae it before expat and pthread

20:01 <mweltin> but after all the boinc stuff

20:01 <mweltin> the MFILE stuff shoudl be standard C stuff

20:02 <MTughan> Even this... bruteForce.cpp:(.text+0x888): undefined reference to `boinc_finish'

20:02 <MTughan> So something's not building right.

20:03 <MTughan> Or linking right, more likely.

20:03 <mweltin> boinc_api

20:03 <mweltin> boincapi is what has the boinc_finish

20:03 <MTughan> I can try telling it to building in the .a manually then.

20:03 <MTughan> s/building/build/

20:04 <mweltin> addingthe -static

20:04 <MTughan> Same.

20:04 <mweltin> without it you will link against a .so

20:05 <mweltin> which you dont' have

20:05 <mweltin> I dont' see it in you build line.

20:05 <MTughan> Still nothing.

20:05 <MTughan> g++ -static -O3 -ffast-math -I/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc -I/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc/api -I/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc/lib -I/home/mtughan/boinc/expat/include -I./lib -L/home/mtughan/boinc/boinc/lib /home/mtughan/boinc/boinc/api/libboinc_api.a -L/home/mtughan/boinc/expat/lib -lboinc lib/*.o -lexpat -lpthread -o build/tsp BruteForce/bruteForce.cpp

20:05 <mweltin> still the MFILE of the boind_finish

20:05 <wdsmia> LOL someone just bounced off my firewall IP: 169.229.154.155

20:05 <wdsmia> DNS: wur-dhcp-154-155.CED.Berkeley.EDU

20:06 <mweltin> is that good wdsmia?

20:06 <MTughan> Well, that's fairly easily traceable...

20:06 <Tank_Master> ib

20:06 <MTughan> No, someone just tried to access his machine, was rebuked by the firewall.

20:06 <mweltin> not good

20:06 <mweltin> well

20:06 <mweltin> not bad either I guess

20:07 <MTughan> And that's what firewalls are for. :P

20:07 <wdsmia> yep

20:07 <mweltin> ipchains?

20:07 <mweltin> I digress

20:07 <MTughan> We know it probably came from the University of Berkeley.

20:08 <MTughan> Scratch that, we KNOW it came from there.

20:08 <Tank_Master> :)

20:08 <MTughan> Maybe someone at BOINC getting jealous of his machines. ^^

20:08 <wdsmia> lol

20:09 <wdsmia> tryed to ping the skype port

20:09 <MTughan> Guess there's an exploit in Skype.

20:10 <MTughan> Well, I'm gonna go up and see how my Mac's doing... brb

20:11 <mweltin> ok

20:13 <wdsmia> mweltin did you get my pm?

20:13 <mweltin> yes

20:13 <mweltin> about using a bench mark machine

20:14 <wdsmia> on the quad that same wu would be about a 5 on my old p4 1.4 about a 20+

20:17 <mweltin> MTughan?

20:17 <Tank_Master> fyi, there is a SP1 in beta for VS2005

20:17 <mweltin> good

20:18 <mweltin> just want I want more beta stuff from MS

20:19 <MTughan> mweltin: Yeah?

20:20 <MTughan> Remind me again... Fedora can use RPMs, right?

20:20 <mweltin> RH = fedora

20:20 <MTughan> What does RPM stand for?

20:20 <mweltin> I moved the call to burtForce.cpp before the libs

20:20 <mweltin> redhat package managment

20:20 <Tank_Master> revolutions per minute

20:20 <MTughan> lol

20:21 <wdsmia> &cyborg rpm

20:21 <Romulus> wdsmia: R.P.M.: Robotic Positronic Machine

20:21 <mweltin> and added the /boinc/include/BONIC dir

20:21 <Tank_Master> :)

20:21 <MTughan> Oh yeah...

20:21 <MTughan> &cad

20:21 <Romulus> http://www.ctrlaltdel-online.com/comic.php

20:21 <mweltin> for looking for headers

20:21 <MTughan> :D

20:22 <MTughan> And...

20:22 <MTughan> &xkcd

20:22 <Romulus> http://www.xkcd.com/

20:22 <mweltin> g++ -static  -I/boinc/include/BOINC -I../lib bruteForce.cpp -L/boinc/lib  -lboinc_api -L/boinc/lib -lboinc ../lib/*.o -lexpat -lpthread -o tsp

20:22 <Tank_Master> thats SAD is old

20:22 <Tank_Master> CAD*

20:22 <MTughan> CAD is old?

20:22 <Tank_Master> read it a few days ago

20:22 <MTughan> It was posted yesterday.

20:23 <Tank_Master> no, seems older than that

20:23 <quail> g'morning, how are we all?

20:23 <MTughan> Refresh the broswer?

20:23 <MTughan> 'lo quail

20:23 <Tank_Master> it was there last time I checked it out

20:23 <mweltin> I was getting the MFILE::flush and ~MFILE errors as well before I switched it around

20:23 <MTughan> Nope, that's from yesterday all right.

20:24 <MTughan> mweltin: You left out expat headers.

20:24 <mweltin> http://xkcd.com/287/

20:24 <Romulus> Title: xkcd - A webcomic of romance, sarcasm, math, and language - By Randall Munroe (at xkcd.com)

20:24 <mweltin> you didn't install expat to the standard place?

20:24 <MTughan> No.

20:25 <mweltin> oh

20:25 <MTughan> If you did though, that's fine.

20:25 <mweltin> i think the Mfile stuff is more the boinc include dir.

20:25 <mweltin> boinc redefines a bunch of stuff according to MSVS

20:25 <mweltin> so you have to take that with a grain of salt.

20:26 <MTughan> MSVS or MSYS?

20:26 <mweltin> MSVS

20:26 <MTughan> What's that?

20:26 <mweltin> Visual Studio

20:26 <MTughan> Ah...

20:26 <mweltin> I never got boinc to compile in msys, which I would call mingw just to be easy

20:27 <mweltin> did you look at the xkcd 287

20:27 <mweltin> funny stuff

20:27 <mweltin> about the TSP

20:28 <Tank_Master> Nice!

20:28 <MTughan> WTF? It built...

20:30 <MTughan> Okay, I think GCC needs to work on how it gets and uses arguments.

20:30 <mweltin> was it the missing includ/BOINC or the position of bruteForce.cpp?

20:31 <mweltin> It hink it was the include

20:31 <mweltin> like I said boinc redfines somethings about MFILE is my guess.

20:31 <mweltin> dont know really

20:31 <mweltin> and I don't care hwat you say, its easier then VisStudio

20:32 <MTughan> It was the position of bruteForce.cpp.

20:32 <mweltin> ok, I could be wrong.

20:32 <mweltin> woulnd't be the first time

20:36 <Tank_Master> lol

20:36 <rubiks120> hey

20:37 <mweltin> rubiks120

20:37 <mweltin> how goes it?

20:38 <rubiks120> its actually going really well

20:38 <mweltin> good, that is good to hear.

20:38 <mweltin> things are going well at TSP too.  I managed to build my app using MS visual studio.

20:39 <rubiks120> I got my thermodynamics exam returned, with a B+ which for me is a good thing, and found out that Im getting a free vacation to North Carolina for the Mieneke Bowl game

20:39 <rubiks120> congrats

20:39 <mweltin> oh and crunhc3r hooked me up with lots of 64 bit apps, and I didn't even have to ask him.

20:39 <mweltin> WOW B+ thermo is hard

20:39 <mweltin> good work.

20:40 <rubiks120> very nice, I did a bunch of reading on the genetic algorthim stuff, I think I understand how they work now too

20:40 <Tank_Master> crunch3r rocks

20:40 <rubiks120> thanks

20:40 <mweltin> sorry ot hear about the bowl game

20:40 <mweltin> GA's are not hard to understand.

20:40 <rubiks120> sorry? we are excied with that game

20:40 <mweltin> the details in getting it to work are much harder than the concept

20:41 *** zombie67 has joined #boinc

20:41 <rubiks120> Id imagine

20:41 <mweltin> Z!

20:41 <Tank_Master> Z!

20:41 <zombie67> hi

20:41 <zombie67> TM:  I screwed up.

20:41 <Tank_Master> you pinged earlier?

20:41 <Tank_Master> oh?

20:41 <zombie67> one of the mobos does not support C2Q

20:41 <Tank_Master> waa?

20:41 <Tank_Master> the gigabyte?

20:42 <zombie67> yeah

20:42 <Tank_Master> crap

20:42 <Tank_Master> the only one we didnt look into

20:42 <mweltin> you two and you computer talk, its like watching an old married couple.

20:42 <Tank_Master> man, sorry about that

20:42 <Tank_Master> can I have it? ;)

20:42 <zombie67> yeah, it has a C2D on it, so I didn't look very closely

20:43 <mweltin> rubiks120 I'm going diving later, but we should talk about how to put the GA together soon.  Maybe use the science discussion board, no one uses that.

20:43 <zombie67> to to this page:  http://www.giga-byte.com/Support/Motherboard/BIOS_List.aspx

20:44 <Romulus> Title: GIGABYTE - Support - Motherboard - BIOS (at www.giga-byte.com)

20:44 <mweltin> and don't worrie if you get caught up with school/life/anything else not boinc related

20:44 <zombie67> select GA-9xxxx

20:44 <mweltin> I had a hard time doing anything extra while I was in school.

20:44 <rubiks120> mweltin, if you want we can communicate via email

20:44 <rubiks120> I am actually heading down to work in about 10 minutes or so

20:44 <Tank_Master> dive? at night?

20:45 <mweltin> that works too, but I like the idea of the message board

20:45 <mweltin> night diving is COOL

20:45 <rubiks120> ok then message board it is

20:45 <mweltin> there is all kinds of stuff that is not out during the day.

20:45 <Tank_Master> yeah it is

20:45 <xcamel> try it in a blinding snowstorm...

20:45 <mweltin> i can see why fishing at night is illegal

20:46 <Tank_Master> Z, whats the mobo moddle?

20:46 <mweltin> you can swim right up on a sleeping fish and touch it if you want.

20:46 <mweltin> If's F'n crazy.

20:46 <zombie67> ga-945gm-s2

20:46 <Tank_Master> wow

20:46 <zombie67> then click on CPU support list

20:46 <mweltin> There are all kinds of freak crabs, and lobster like things out as well as octopi at night

20:47 <Tank_Master> rev 1 or 3?

20:47 <Tank_Master> quad is on the rev1 list

20:48 <zombie67> listed as "N/A"

20:48 <Tank_Master> right

20:48 <Tank_Master> just saw that

20:48 <xcamel> sounds like 'supercamel"

20:48 <zombie67> neither rev supports it

20:48 <Tank_Master> man

20:48 <Tank_Master> so now what?

20:48 <rubiks120> sell it?

20:48 <Tank_Master> new mobo n ram?

20:48 <zombie67> return i, I guess.

20:48 <zombie67> ha!

20:48 <Tank_Master> or I can use it ;)

20:49 <zombie67> find me an micro ATX mobo that supports C2Q

20:49 <Tank_Master> fry's just hadn aecs one on sale

20:49 <freelarry> msi p35

20:49 <Tank_Master> has an ECS*

20:49 <xcamel> >> http://einstein.phys.uwm.edu/show_host_detail.php?hostid=989567

20:49 * zombie67 is eating turkey and stuffing

20:49 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/1CyT> (at einstein.phys.uwm.edu)

20:49 <freelarry> not sure if micro tho

20:50 <efc> Are the opterons/xeons any significantly faster for boinc stuff?

20:50 <zombie67> nope

20:51 <freelarry> http://www.compucare.com/Catalog.aspx?cid=56&page=1&OPos=1

20:51 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/1CyV> (at www.compucare.com)

20:51 <zombie67> just more cores, so faster in that way

20:51 <efc> seems like it was always 5X the price for a little more cache, and SMP (a feature all CPUs had not too long ago)

20:52 <zombie67> can't get to 8 cores without opteron or xeon

20:53 <freelarry> http://www.compucare.com/product/mlbmsi171.aspx

20:53 <Romulus> Title: Compucare.com (at www.compucare.com)

20:54 <efc> when you say 8 you mean 2x4 ?

20:54 <freelarry> is the one i purchased - book that was in box says will support quad but ad only says c2duo

20:54 <zombie67> http://www.giga-byte.us/Products/Motherboard/Products_Spec.aspx?ClassValue=Motherboard&ProductID=2572&ProductName=GA-965GM-S2

20:54 <Romulus> Title: GIGABYTE - Product - Motherboard - Specification - GA-965GM-S2 (rev. 2.0) (at www.giga-byte.us)

20:55 <mweltin> crap I can't login to my own site

20:55 <mweltin> my inbox

20:55 <Tank_Master> lol

20:55 <mweltin> I can't get to it

20:55 <Tank_Master> man

20:55 <efc> 8 cores would probably hit nuclear fusion temperatures.. the CPU could power itself

20:55 <rubiks120> thats a bit of a problem there

20:56 <mweltin> I dont' get it

20:56 <mweltin> I never had to do it before

20:56 <mweltin> I just went to the message boards and there was a lilnk to my inbox

20:56 <rubiks120> ok well time for work, ill catch up with you later mweltin

20:56 <zombie67> efc, yes, 2x4core

20:56 <mweltin> later rubiks120

20:56 <Tank_Master> hf

20:56 <rubiks120> its easy work, Im heading down there to play some pool

20:57 <zombie67> gotta call thailand now

20:57 <zombie67> bbl

20:57 <Tank_Master> hf

20:57 *** zombie67 has left #boinc

20:57 *** rubiks120 is now known as rubiks120|afk

20:58 <mweltin> Germans love the boinc

20:58 <Tank_Master> all frikin keenky

20:58 <Tank_Master> oh? hows that?

20:58 <mweltin> just tons of them sign up for TSP

20:59 <mweltin> whenever I check new users

20:59 <xcamel> karz for kidz >> http://www.qdoscars.co.uk/zest.htm

20:59 <Romulus> Title: The Acrea Zest (at www.qdoscars.co.uk)

20:59 <mweltin> there is always someone from Germany

20:59 <Tank_Master> :)

20:59 <mweltin> Of course I have only checked it 5 times

20:59 <mweltin> but still

21:00 <mweltin> curnch3rr is German, and yoyo is, adn the guy that did the icons and logo was german.

21:00 <Tank_Master> that one dude

21:00 <mweltin> I guess I notice them more because how active they are.

21:00 <Tank_Master> z n I are american

21:00 <Tank_Master> MT I think is candibean

21:01 <xcamel> TM.. is TSP yours?

21:01 <mweltin> yeah, well not everyone

21:01 <mweltin> yes

21:01 <mweltin> tsp is TM's

21:01 <mweltin> unless you like it

21:01 <mweltin> then it's mine

21:01 <xcamel> uh-huh

21:01 <mweltin> no its mine

21:01 <mweltin> sorry to confuse you.

21:02 <efc> Did you solve, or figure out how long it would take, on the brute force version of TSP?

21:02 <xcamel> I'm never confused

21:02 <mweltin> something I can do for you?

21:02 <mweltin> Pov did

21:02 <mweltin> some redonkulous number of cpu years

21:02 <mweltin> well past my death.

21:02 <Tank_Master> 43252378

21:03 <Tank_Master> and I even tyoed that with a straight face

21:03 <xcamel> based on how many points?

21:03 <mweltin> that looks right

21:03 <mweltin> I try not to think about it.

21:03 <efc> Something within reach? I mean, solving an arbitrary instance doesn't produce much, unless it helps you with the next phase, so you'd like to pick one small enough that there will be a next phase

21:04 <mweltin> maybe I should really look into some of those optimizations.

21:04 <Tank_Master> ill bbl

21:04 <Tank_Master> dinner

21:04 <mweltin> I'm going to run apps in parralle

21:04 <Tank_Master> hf diving in the dark

21:04 <mweltin> will do

21:04 <efc> My star finding algorithm might actually be a good BOINCer, more for the storage requirements than the CPU

21:05 <xcamel> minimum distance goto calculations?

21:06 <mweltin> yeah that is a good place to start

21:06 <mweltin> each permutation diffrers by only one city

21:06 <efc> I've been interested in the following problem: Given the starfield (viewable stars) given from some unknown location, and a complete catalog of stars, locate where the view was taken from

21:06 <mweltin> so I shouldn't have to do 47 summing operations

21:07 <mweltin> I should be able to do one subtraction and one addition for each subsequent path.

21:07 <efc> mw: Sounds like "dynamic programming" (its a bad name but well known)

21:07 <mweltin> sounds very cool efc

21:08 <xcamel> minimum distance goto x triangulation in a 3D space

21:08 <mweltin> that is a bad name, I have seen it used in Neural Net papers and Genetic Algorithm papers and I still don't know what it means.

21:08 <efc> I think I found a good algorithm to do it.. haven't coded it, or run a full scale simulation (200 billion stars, a lot to handle)

21:08 <mweltin> sounds like a good boinc project

21:08 <efc> mw: its where you tabulate partial solutions so you don't have to compute them again. Basically.

21:08 <xcamel> start with the messier catalog

21:09 <xcamel> the position of any 3 and the time will give  you your exact location

21:09 <efc> I'm only considering star geometry - no using "landmarks" (external galaxies would make it fairly easy)

21:09 <efc> The computational geometry aspect of it is the most interesting to me

21:09 <xcamel> hint: all stars are landmarks

21:10 <mweltin> I got freaked out when I got here. I figured I'd be albe to see all the stars I'm used to.

21:10 <mweltin> but nope, 45 degrees north to 14 south and I have no idea what is up in the sky.

21:11 <MTughan> That's what I get for playing Vector TD for a while...

21:11 <efc> Just based on geometry is the purest and hardest version.. the more you add (spectroscopy, apparent magnitudes, external reference points) the easier it gets, but the less interesting to me

21:11 <MTughan> Tank_Master: Candibean?

21:12 <mweltin> who needs easy.

21:12 <xcamel> it would be like inventing a square wheel

21:12 <mweltin> my poor dog si going to drop from the heat.

21:12 <efc> I already got a "simulated galaxy" going. It was pretty hard to get any kind of realistic distribution of star types. I don't think what I got is very good, but it'll do

21:12 <mweltin> no kidding

21:12 <mweltin> just from teh catalog

21:13 <mweltin> you got your own simulated galaxy ?

21:13 <efc> Yeah, just locations and absolute magnitudes. Locations are random, magnitudes according to some data I found on statistics of local stars.

21:13 <mweltin> so is your final result a position on earth or a position in the sky.

21:14 <efc> Position in the galaxy

21:14 <mweltin> nice

21:14 <mweltin> I had some software (free ware) that helped you locate starts.

21:14 <mweltin> it was cool, sort of panned around liek google earth.

21:15 <efc> BSG just executed a blind jump.. Need to find where they are before the Cylons show up. Don't have time to measure spectroscopy.

21:15 <mweltin> gave you a horizon, you coudl super impose constelations in the sky.

21:15 <efc> Stellarium and Celestia are great

21:15 <xcamel> problem - dynamic forces changing the shape and size of the galaxy, and cosmic drift

21:15 <mweltin> those sound about right

21:16 <mweltin> thats kind of a slow force xcamel

21:16 <xcamel> your base data is only good for a frozen instant in time

21:16 <efc> Well the stars aren't exactly moving fast, and presumably Rand McNally measured their instantaneous velocity, so its good for a little while

21:17 <xcamel> ah.. but a little drift over a few thousand lightyears makes for big errors

21:17 <mweltin> I'll give you that

21:18 <mweltin> but who is going to prove efc wrong

21:18 <efc> It would be small angular errors. But once you have match 3 or 4 known stars, then you can match the other 6,000 or so in view, and that should even out the errors pretty well.

21:18 <xcamel> use the DSS maps and the enormity of the problem will make your head explode

21:19 <mweltin> thats why i'm getting out while the getting is good.  besides I have to get ready for my dive.

21:19 <mweltin> later guys

21:19 <efc> Later mw

21:19 <xcamel> laterz..

21:19 *** mweltin has left #boinc

21:19 <efc> The enormity is what makes it cool :)

21:20 <xcamel> delete the gravity lens problem - bending space isn't fair

21:20 <efc> "Simulating" the galaxy in any kind of realistic way is hard too, the real thing isn't totally random placement. There are multi-star systems, and density waves that make up the arms, etc

21:21 <xcamel> the "cosmic refraction" problem

21:21 <xcamel> nothing is ever where you think it is

21:21 <efc> Not exactly, but thats more significant on the galactic scale

21:22 <MTughan> Anyone know how to take screenshots in Linux? FC7, specifically.

21:22 <xcamel> x,y,z, and S(t)

21:22 <xcamel> there is a screenshot app included

21:22 <MTughan> S(t) refers to time?

21:22 <xcamel> spacetime

21:22 <MTughan> Ah.

21:22 <MTughan> The 4 dimensions...

21:23 <efc> They never talked about navigation much in BSG.. it must be interesting. Since they are in unexplored space if I recall right.

21:23 <MTughan> Well, I can't find the screenshot app... Oh well.

21:24 <xcamel> looking..

21:24 <MTughan> Heh... Even WINE apps are taken in by Compiz...

21:24 <MTughan> KDE, BTW.

21:25 <xcamel> ksnapshot

21:28 <xcamel> in the graphics menu

21:30 <MTughan> Sorry, immersed in a game of Minesweeper.

21:30 <Tank_Master> hehe

21:30 *** BadBarbarian has quit IRC

21:30 <Tank_Master> Bumper sticker spotted on a Silverado pickup truck on Loop 610 in Houston , Texas , on Oct. 30, 2007.

21:30 <Tank_Master> I wish Hillary had married OJ!!

21:33 <efc> Aww I wouldn't wish that on OJ

21:34 <Tank_Master> rofl!

21:34 <xcamel> I would..

21:41 <xcamel> close enough... she married bill, and had web hubble's baby...

21:45 <efc> I think there will be a new line of deductions on my pay stub

21:45 <efc> Right now, there's the FDR line and the LBJ line. Soon, the HRC line.

21:45 <Tank_Master> ?

21:46 <efc> FDR - social security. LBJ - "the great society" medicare/caid/welfare. HRC - Universal healthcare.

21:46 <MTughan> The US is implementing that?

21:46 <Tank_Master> damn socilist movemnet

21:47 <Tank_Master> its looking like it

21:47 <Tank_Master> probably not even goign to vote on it

21:47 <efc> there's a lot of talk, nothing near imminent yet. The prez candidates are falling over each other trying to out-promise each other

21:47 <Tank_Master> err let us vote

21:47 <xcamel> not going to happen..

21:47 <MTughan> Hehe... I can beat an easy Minesweeper puzzle in less than 30 seconds.

21:48 <Tank_Master> I think its a bad idea

21:48 <Tank_Master> I can in less than 1 sec

21:48 <MTughan> lol

21:48 <MTughan> The Beginner puzzle.

21:48 <MTughan> 22 seconds now.

21:48 <Tank_Master> custum

21:48 <Tank_Master> largest size with 10 mines

21:49 <MTughan> Yes, I was the one who told you about it, remember?

21:49 <efc> I've got a version around somewhere that could do arbitrarily large fields

21:49 <MTughan> Nice... 13 seconds.

21:50 <Tank_Master> well, I did it WWAAYY before you told me

21:50 <MTughan> You and me both then.

21:57 <xcamel> well.. off with me.

21:57 <efc> Night X

21:57 <efc> Sweet dreams of HRC in the oval office :)

22:00 <Tank_Master> gn xcam

22:06 *** zombie67 has joined #boinc

22:06 <Tank_Master> Z!

22:06 <zombie67> buying a new mobo

22:07 <Tank_Master> LOL

22:07 <Tank_Master> thought you might

22:07 <Tank_Master> again, sorry for that overlook

22:07 <zombie67> I had already "spent" those cores in my head.  can't return it now!

22:07 <zombie67> I completely missed it too.

22:07 <zombie67> http://www.giga-byte.us/Products/Motherboard/Products_Overview.aspx?ProductID=2563

22:07 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/1CzH> (at www.giga-byte.us)

22:07 <Tank_Master> figured gigabyte wouldnt do that

22:08 <zombie67> micro ATX, integrated graphics

22:08 <zombie67> and OCable!

22:08 <Tank_Master> sweet

22:08 <Tank_Master> how much?

22:08 <zombie67> $75 +S/H

22:08 <Tank_Master> not bad

22:08 <Tank_Master> you get ram with it?

22:08 <zombie67> I already have RAM

22:09 <Tank_Master> k

22:09 <Tank_Master> good

22:09 <zombie67> in the box

22:09 <zombie67> 2gb

22:09 <Tank_Master> decent amount

22:09 <zombie67> ooo!

22:09 <zombie67> let me count the slots in the current board.  brb

22:09 <Tank_Master> 4

22:09 <zombie67> uh oh

22:09 <Tank_Master> 2?

22:09 <Tank_Master> 1GB?

22:10 <zombie67> I currently have 4x512

22:10 <Tank_Master> ouch

22:10 <Tank_Master> so 1GB in the current and 1GB in the new mobo

22:10 <zombie67> the current mobo will have no home

22:10 <Tank_Master> not gonna run it at all?

22:10 <zombie67> no box for it

22:10 <Tank_Master> so?

22:11 <zombie67> no, trying to reduce boxes!

22:11 <Tank_Master> run boxless

22:11 <zombie67> http://www.giga-byte.us/Products/Motherboard/Products_Overview.aspx?ProductID=2528

22:11 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/1CzX> (at www.giga-byte.us)

22:11 <zombie67> it's not the boxes, it is the # of PSUs

22:12 <MTughan> I didn't think PSUs were that expensive either.

22:12 <zombie67> not the cost of PSUs, the cost of the power!

22:12 <Tank_Master> no, but the cost $$ to run

22:12 <Tank_Master> ill take the mobo then ;)

22:13 <zombie67> heh

22:13 <Tank_Master> I got an extra 500w at home

22:13 <Tank_Master> and case

22:13 <Tank_Master> HD

22:13 <Tank_Master> CDrom..

22:13 <Tank_Master> no extra DDR2 mem though

22:13 <MTughan> And even though it works, I'll take anything over a P4. :P

22:13 <zombie67> $109 + S/H

22:13 <Tank_Master> that that second mobo link?

22:13 <zombie67> it costs me $34 to be able to reuse my DIMMs

22:14 <zombie67> yeah

22:14 <Tank_Master> well, it dose support 45nm

22:14 <Tank_Master> thats nice

22:15 <MTughan> When I go off to university, I might look at upgrading this machine...

22:15 <MTughan> I love the case, it's quiet and quite cool.

22:15 <MTughan> And looks cool too. ;)

22:15 <zombie67> quiet is the most important

22:16 <zombie67> man, 2x1gb DDR2 800 = $45

22:16 <MTughan> O_O

22:16 <zombie67> memory is dirt cheap now

22:16 <MTughan> Dude, that's cheap...

22:17 <zombie67> http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=2000170147+1052308477+1052416064&name=DDR2+800+(PC2+6400)

22:17 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/1Cz_> (at www.newegg.com)

22:17 <MTughan> I paid $350 for 2x1GB DDR2 667 last year...

22:17 <zombie67> 2x1gb DDR2 667 is $40

22:18 <MTughan> Here it is... This is my case. http://www.lian-li.com/product/product06.php?pr_index=17&cl_index=1&sc_index=1&ss_index=4&type=a

22:18 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/1Czb> (at www.lian-li.com)

22:18 <MTughan> Surprised they're still selling it, mine's over 3 years old now.

22:18 <zombie67> nice and clean look

22:18 <MTughan> 4 case fans too. ;)

22:19 <MTughan> Plus 1 on the CPU, GPU, PSU...

22:19 <zombie67> when I build these two microatx boxes, there was no such thing as a microatx mobo that would OC

22:19 <zombie67> now they are everywhere!

22:19 <MTughan> How times have changed...

22:20 <MTughan> I still remember some 5.25" floppies. :P

22:20 <MTughan> Now we have 8GB USB sticks for under $100.

22:20 <zombie67> probably won't fit much more than the stock HS, but that should still be enough for some mild OC

22:21 <Tank_Master> I got kingston hyperX in my comp here (DDR2800)

22:21 <Tank_Master> running it at 640 with 3/3/3 timmings

22:22 <zombie67> I have a mental block with it comes to understanding mem settings.

22:22 <MTughan> Ditto.

22:22 <zombie67> done.  ordered.

22:22 <Tank_Master> sweet

22:22 <zombie67> glad I paused to talk about it....

22:22 <zombie67> almost ordered the wrong one

22:22 <Tank_Master> so, what r u gonna do witht he 512s?

22:23 <zombie67> it has 4 slots

22:23 <zombie67> http://www.newegg.com/Product/ShowImage.aspx?CurImage=13-128-060-02.jpg&Image=13-128-060-02.jpg%2c13-128-060-03.jpg%2c13-128-060-04.jpg%2c13-128-060-05.jpg%2c13-128-060-06.jpg%2c13-128-060-07.jpg%2c13-128-060-08.jpg&S7ImageFlag=0&Depa=0&Description=GIGABYTE+GA-G33M-S2+Micro+ATX+Intel+Motherboard

22:23 <Romulus> Title: Newegg.com - Computer Parts, PC Components, Laptop Computers, Digital Cameras and more! (at www.newegg.com)

22:25 <zombie67> i see the votes are now 12/12

22:25 <Tank_Master> huh

22:25 <MTughan> On what?

22:25 <zombie67> any luck getting your founder to join?

22:26 <zombie67> http://www.setiusa.net/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=9210&highlight=

22:26 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/1Czk> (at www.setiusa.net)

22:26 <Tank_Master> not yet

22:27 <MTughan> zombie67: It's asking for a login.

22:27 <Tank_Master> hehe

22:27 <Tank_Master> you need to join the messageboard first

22:27 <zombie67> check this:  http://boincstats.com/stats/user_stats.php?pr=wcg&st=0&ti=8857

22:27 <MTughan> No.

22:27 <Romulus> <http://ln-s.net/1Czm> (at boincstats.com)

22:28 <Tank_Master> yes

22:28 <Tank_Master> thats better Z

22:28 <MTughan> jeffreyloaf?

22:28 <zombie67> so even though my team is in the race, it is really a team of 1

22:28 <zombie67> ....me

22:28 <MTughan> Nice...

22:28 <Tank_Master> :P

22:29 <zombie67> I still think I'll do pretty good.

22:29 <MTughan> What race?

22:29 <zombie67> http://www.worldcommunitygrid.org/team/challenge/viewTeamChallenge.do?challengeId=465

22:29 <Romulus> Title: World Community Grid - Team Challenge Detail (at www.worldcommunitygrid.org)

22:29 <zombie67> http://www.boincteams.com/viewtopic.php?t=285

22:30 <zombie67> Christmas race

22:30 <MTughan> So that's why you're crunching WCG...

22:31 <zombie67> yep

22:32 <zombie67> is your team in the race?

22:32 <MTughan> Dunno yet...

22:32 <MTughan> I didn't see if by a search.

22:32 <zombie67> what's your boinc name?

22:32 <MTughan> My team is UserFriendly.org.

22:33 <MTughan> We are one of the top teams on WCG...

22:33 <zombie67> #7

22:33 <MTughan> 8th in all time points.

22:35 <zombie67> #7 of just the BOINC points, #8 including UD

22:36 <zombie67> my team is #454

22:36 <zombie67> including UD

22:36 <zombie67> I think we will move up significantly by xmas!

22:36 <MTughan> Big talk there...

22:36 <zombie67> okay, I am outta here.

22:37 <MTughan> Bye.

22:37 <zombie67> the points will speak for themselves.  ;)

22:37 <zombie67> bye!

22:37 *** zombie67 has quit IRC

22:40 *** Tank_Master_ has joined #BOINC

22:41 <Tank_Master_> I suppose I soulda said that ill brb

22:41 <MTughan> And you never quit.

22:42 <Tank_Master_> desided that there was WAAAYY to much dist in my CPU heatsink then a bunny started rolling around in ut making odd and bad noises

22:43 <Tank_Master_> dust*

22:44 <Tank_Master_> waa hoo! more rain tomorrow

22:47 *** Tank_Master has quit IRC

22:49 *** Tank_Master_ is now known as Tank_Master

22:54 <MTughan> I have to be off...

22:54 <Tank_Master> gn

22:54 *** MTughan has quit IRC

23:17 *** MTughan has joined #boinc

23:17 <MTughan> Got Colloquy back...

23:18 <Tank_Master> ?

23:19 <MTughan> My IRC client for OS X.

23:19 <Tank_Master> ahh

23:22 <MTughan> And have my style back, so it almost looks like it did before...

23:22 <MTughan> Almost. Missing one thing...

23:22 <MTughan> And unfortunately, I'm not sure where to get it.

23:36 <efc> wow, they are running some really old Leno now hehe

23:39 <MTughan> brb

23:39 *** MTughan has quit IRC

23:39 *** MTughan has joined #boinc

23:40 <MTughan> Moved Colloquy to its final place. It was sitting on my desktop.

23:46 <MTughan> mweltin's not here... I just thought of something. The PPC apps for TSP won't run on Panther.

23:47 <MTughan> They're built with GCC 4.0, which is TIger only.

23:47 <Tank_Master> 10.3?

23:47 <MTughan> Yeah, 10.3.

23:47 <Tank_Master> ahh

23:47 <Tank_Master> yeahm been reading about compatibility issues with 10.3 for the BOINC client to

23:47 <MTughan> I'll have to correct that when I get it back up.

23:48 <MTughan> They have compatibility issues on Panther?

23:48 <Tank_Master> the installer

23:48 <MTughan> Oh yeah... That makes some sense.

23:50 <MTughan> Well, now that my Tiger installation is currently out, now might be a good time to upgrade to Leopard.

23:50 <MTughan> I'll be starting fresh anyway.

23:50 <Tank_Master> tigar is 10.5, right?

23:51 <Tank_Master> to meny names to keep track of ;)

23:51 <MTughan> Panther is 10.3, Tiger is 10.4, Leopard is 10.5.

23:51 <Tank_Master> ahh, ok

23:51 *** hawmps has quit IRC

23:51 <Tank_Master> I know berkeley was wating for 10.5 to come out befor building a 64bit MAC client, but I havent heard a word since it came out

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