IRC logs of #boinc for Monday, 2008-04-07

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00:26 <zombie67> people often don't understand that email != outlook/thunderbeird/whatever

00:26 <PovAddict> huh

00:26 <zombie67> even after you explain it to them

00:26 <zombie67> over and over again

00:27 <PovAddict> actually, most people think email is accessible from a browser

00:27 <PovAddict> "why would you use another program to access your email?!"

00:27 <zombie67> no, people think yahoo = email

00:27 <PovAddict> exactly

00:27 <zombie67> no, not the same

00:27 <zombie67> at all

00:27 <PovAddict> yahoo = web mail

00:28 <zombie67> they think yahoo IS email

00:28 <PovAddict> well those are beyond saving

00:28 <zombie67> they don't understand that yahoo is just a web interface to email

00:28 * PovAddict looks around for Saenger

00:28 <zombie67> that is my mom

00:28 <zombie67> that is my dad

00:29 <zombie67> they tell me "my yahoo isn't working"

00:29 <PovAddict> Saenger complained about "why would i download a separate program to access forums?" when I was talking about my NNTP stuff

00:30 <zombie67> that's like saying, why do i need a modem?  I can just listen to the noises

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00:31 <zombie67> Why do we need SETI@home?  We can just look at the sky

00:31 <PovAddict> well there is a difference

00:31 <PovAddict> without a modem you can't read your yahoo

00:31 <zombie67> a NNTP client helps us manage all that data, filter it, make it meaningful

00:32 <PovAddict> but without an NNTP client you can still use the browser

00:32 <PovAddict> it sucks, but I can read it, so if it works, why should I get another program

00:32 <wdsmia> asks PovAddict to please watch his or her language Thanks, your friendly channel op.

00:33 <zombie67> a raw message feed is like looking at the sky.  Using nntp and a good client makes it meaning ful

00:33 <PovAddict> I need a better nntp client

00:33 <zombie67> we all do

00:33 <Didactylos> Usenet is an underused concept.

00:34 <zombie67> I grew up on usenet, and love it

00:34 <zombie67> people are scared of unmoderated forums

00:34 <PovAddict> Didactylos: I wrote my own NNTP server while attempting to get BOINC forums on it, but it's now yet another unfinished and dropped project

00:34 <zombie67> I feed moderation is stifling.  *I* will be my *OWN* moderator.  Thanks.

00:35 <zombie67> *feel

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00:35 <zombie67> all I need is a client with decent filtering

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00:36 <Didactylos> Don't you wish all net fora had a killfile?

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00:36 <zombie67> amen!

00:37 <zombie67> "GEnie is quiet and polite, the equivalent of chatting in a nice hotel lobby, with cups of tea and palm fronds. CompuServe is more like a convention, with lots of conversations going on at once.  Usenet reminds me of a University Student Union Bar ('Look, yah, I mean what Keirkegaard was saying was, oh gross Sharon, no-one wants to see your tattoo, well gosh, if you're buying I'll have another pint')." -- Neil Gaiman

00:38 <zombie67> my fave:  "Usenet is not a right."  "Usenet is a right, a left, a jab, and a sharp uppercut to the jaw.  The postman hits!  You have new mail. " -- Ed Vielmetti & Chip Salzenberg

00:39 <zombie67> pov:  I think 6.1.x may have a bug

00:39 <PovAddict> zombie67: yawn

00:39 <PovAddict> got any news?

00:39 <zombie67> lattice will have work again very soon

00:39 <zombie67> Kimi R. came in 2nd

00:40 <zombie67>

00:40 <Romulus> <> (at

00:41 <PovAddict> if anyone is interested (and knows Java, and dares look at it), here's the never-completed newsserver

00:41 <Romulus> Title: WebSVN - nntp-server - Rev 11 - /trunk/src/ar/com/povaddict/nntpforum/ (at

00:42 <zombie67> Pov, whatever happened to that big rendering project?

00:42 <PovAddict> last revision looks like I started changing the structure and never filled in the implementation... I wonder if it works at all

00:42 <zombie67> just finished watching beowulf

00:43 <PovAddict> zombie67: I couldn't manage to compile a povray that doesn't screw up the image, and didn't try too much

00:43 <zombie67> do all medieval tales have to be so dreary?

00:43 <zombie67> ok

00:43 <PovAddict> lol

00:43 <Romulus> Title: xkcd - A webcomic of romance, sarcasm, math, and language - By Randall Munroe (at

00:43 <zombie67> well, if you want to try again, lemme know

00:43 <Didactylos> I had fun with PovRay back in the day.

00:44 <Didactylos> PovAddict: do you have art somewhere?

00:44 <zombie67> reminds me of the futurama episode "How Heremes got his Grove Back."

00:44 <PovAddict> under most definitions of "art", no I don't

00:45 <zombie67> nothing but flowers

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00:45 <zombie67> rb

00:45 <zombie67> brb

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00:46 <Didactylos> s/art/images/

00:47 <PovAddict> but note some stuff there may not be mine

00:47 <Romulus> Title: Index of /pov (at

00:48 <PovAddict> like... modifying somebody else's scene, and I put images there to give the link...

00:48 <zombie67> what is the url to the povray stuff?

00:48 <PovAddict> which povray stuff?

00:48 <zombie67> the one that leo talked about

00:48 <zombie67> bunches of examples

00:49 <PovAddict> hall of fame?

00:49 <PovAddict>

00:49 <Romulus> Title: POV-Ray Hall of Fame (at

00:49 <zombie67> Ding!  Thanks!

00:53 <Didactylos> The lego?

00:53 <PovAddict> for the mybot I used

00:54 <Romulus> Title: El Lutzo's LGEO POV-Ray Library (at

00:54 <PovAddict> but there is some lego stuff there which is my own modeling too

00:56 <Didactylos> I've lost the source for most of my work.

00:56 <Didactylos> Devastating.

00:57 <Didactylos> This was... what? Over 12 years ago.

00:57 <zombie67> The FB powers that be say that AI must be Black-Listed due to possible "commercial use".  I never say that as anything but GOOD for BOINC.

00:58 <Didactylos> FB?

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00:59 <zombie67> Formula BOINC:

00:59 <Romulus> Title: Formula Boinc (at

01:00 <Didactylos> PovAddict: only a few of them benefit from raytracing.

01:00 <zombie67> it is the best way (IMO) to do cross-project stats.

01:00 <Didactylos> I did a pen once with some awesome refraction.

01:00 <zombie67> you don't compare credits.  you compare rank.

01:00 <PovAddict> only a few of what?

01:00 <Didactylos> Those images.

01:01 <PovAddict> not like povray has a way to choose rendering algorithms :)

01:01 <Didactylos> Like the jewels, and that cool radiosity image.

01:02 <Didactylos> No?

01:02 <Romulus> hmm... No is I supposed to, Didactylos

01:02 <Didactylos> I don't know if you're serious.

01:02 <PovAddict> povray *is* a raytracer and that's all it can do

01:02 <Didactylos> Max lets you do selective raytracing.

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01:02 <Romulus> have made it work if you wanted to scream here

01:03 <Didactylos> I miss PovRay, though.

01:03 <Didactylos> You've got me feeling all nostalgic.

01:03 <zombie67> I got 4 more tasks from BRaTS two days ago.

01:04 <Didactylos> Oh YES!

01:04 <Didactylos> I found it! I knew I never deleted anything in the last - ever.

01:04 <PovAddict> heh

01:04 <Didactylos> All archived and hidden away.

01:05 <Didactylos> Mostly .TGA

01:05 <PovAddict> no sources?

01:05 <zombie67> hah!  I'm 13th (RAC) at BURP.  Now I will start trying harder.

01:05 <Didactylos> Sources, everything.

01:06 <zombie67> Nice.  No bit rot?

01:07 <PovAddict> there may be

01:07 <PovAddict> once he tries rendering one and he has problems with his pre-3.1 syntax, the bit rot will show :)

01:08 <Tank_Master> lol

01:08 <zombie67> TM!

01:08 <Tank_Master> yo

01:08 <zombie67> you're back!?

01:08 <Tank_Master> got back yesterday

01:09 <zombie67> straight up and back?  No adventure?

01:09 <Didactylos> PovAddict: but that's the wonderful thing - still have the version I wrote for.

01:09 <Tank_Master> gave a comp to my g-ma for her birthday, that was enough adventure

01:09 <Didactylos> Did the format change much?

01:10 <PovAddict> Didactylos: not really, and current versions very possibly will render any old code provided the correct #version directive

01:10 <PovAddict> syntax compatibility is kept very well

01:10 <zombie67> boinc installed as service....right?

01:10 <Tank_Master> yep

01:10 <zombie67> heh

01:10 <Tank_Master> with climate

01:10 <zombie67> attached via BAM?

01:10 <Tank_Master> (she has dial-up)

01:10 <Tank_Master> no

01:10 <Tank_Master> no point

01:10 <PovAddict> Didactylos: but yeah, in any case, you can download old versions from povray ftp

01:11 * zombie67 is confused

01:11 <Tank_Master> only on a few hrs a day, and on dial up

01:11 <Tank_Master> I just hope climate will finish within a year

01:11 <zombie67> so how do you control it?

01:11 <Tank_Master> I dont

01:11 <zombie67> ah!

01:11 <zombie67> you mean CPDN!

01:11 <Tank_Master> ya

01:11 <Tank_Master> those WUs will run for months

01:11 <zombie67> i thought you meant it was cool temp there.

01:12 <Tank_Master> I should be back there by then to ensure that are updated

01:13 <Didactylos> Some of these are dated 1994.

01:16 <PovAddict> and I bet they render ridiculously fast on your current machine :)

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01:22 <PovAddict> "the last guardian" is a slow render for sure

01:22 <PovAddict> 116 pixels per minute

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01:29 <efc> Can't wait for the real time ray tracing that Intel wants

01:29 <efc> I predict games will have a lot of reflective balls and checkerboard patterns

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01:32 <Didactylos_> Okay, we will call that a "partial success".

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01:50 <Didactylos_> There we go. Turning off the ancient preview may solve crashingness.

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01:52 <Didactylos> Even with a computer zillions of times faster, refraction is still sloooooooooow.

01:53 <Didactylos> The supersampling may have something to do with it, also....

01:56 <efc> Jackie Chan in a dramatic role?!

01:56 <efc> &weather Hell

01:56 <Romulus> efc: Temperature: 45.6F / 7.6C | Humidity: 61% | Pressure: 29.91in / 1012.8hPa (Steady) | Conditions: Clear | Wind Direction: NW | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Overnight - Partly cloudy...then becoming mostly cloudy toward daybreak. Isolated sprinkles after 2 am. Lows 42 to 46. Southeast winds 5 to 10 mph.; Monday - Mostly cloudy during the morning. Mostly sunny during the afternoon. Windy. A chance of (1 more message)

02:04 <Didactylos> John thinks the BOINC website should be "cool".

02:04 <Didactylos> Some tasteful reverse video, perhaps?

02:07 <efc> <BLINK>

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04:05 <clusty> j #ubuntu+1

04:05 <clusty> :D

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04:50 * CoderForLife stumbles in

04:50 <CoderForLife> &wx 45140

04:50 <Romulus> CoderForLife: Temperature: 47.8F / 8.8C | Humidity: 100% | Pressure: 29.89in / 1012.1hPa (Steady) | Conditions: Overcast | Wind Direction: SW | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Today - Mostly sunny. Highs in the lower 70s. Southwest winds 5 to 10 mph.; Tonight - Mostly clear. Lows in the upper 40s. West winds 5 to 10 mph...becoming northeast after midnight.; Tuesday - Partly sunny. A slight chance of showers (1 more message)

04:50 <CoderForLife> &more

04:50 <Romulus> CoderForLife: and thunderstorms in the afternoon. Highs in the lower 70s. East winds 5 to 10 mph...becoming south in the afternoon. Chance of rain 20 percent.;

04:56 <CoderForLife>;jsessionid=Q5XHY1IQ4BTNCQSNDLPSKH0CJUNN2JVN?articleID=207001912&_requestid=315829

04:56 <Romulus> <> (at

04:59 <CoderForLife> breakfast time - brb

05:06 * CoderForLife returns with food

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05:26 <_Danilo_> hi to all

05:27 <CoderForLife> hello _Danilo_

05:27 <_Danilo_> hello CoderForLife :)

05:27 <CoderForLife> pretty quiet here this morning

05:28 <CoderForLife> and I'm going to get ready to go to w@#%

05:28 <CoderForLife> have a good one

05:29 * CoderForLife rolls away

05:29 <_Danilo_> bye

05:34 * KathrynM is back (gone 05:46:52)

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06:18 <hawmps-away> 'lo

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08:04 <Agiofws> hello

08:04 <Agiofws> can i  ask  something ...

08:05 <KathrynM_> sure

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08:05 <Agiofws> i am using  boinc

08:05 <Agiofws> client

08:05 <Agiofws> to connect  to burp.boinc ...

08:07 <Agiofws> ATM  i have uploaded my  "data" to burp and its getting processed .. if i stop the  boinc client   will my data prossesing  be stoped or stalled ?

08:07 <KathrynM> If you look at the status of the work unit, is it ready to report or running?

08:09 <hawmps> once they have the WU, you don't have to worry about it any more

08:09 <hawmps> the next time you connect, you'll get the credits due

08:09 <Agiofws> WU

08:10 <Agiofws> status of the work unit, is it ready to report or running?  ?

08:10 <Agiofws> where is that ?

08:10 <Romulus> or what drives many of the ATA crowd

08:10 <KathrynM> on the "tasks" tab

08:11 <desti> do you crunch burp or do you upload work for crunching?

08:11 <Agiofws> KathrynM,  on  the burp  site ?

08:11 <Agiofws> or the boinc site ?

08:12 <KathrynM> In your BOINC manager

08:12 <Agiofws> ok

08:12 <Agiofws> well there is working on other peoples ... work

08:13 <Agiofws> yes

08:13 <Agiofws> i have 4 tasks

08:13 <KathrynM> Oh, you mean you uploaded a session to be rendered?

08:14 <Agiofws> yes

08:14 <Agiofws> if i stop the client will work on  farm be stopped ?

08:14 <KathrynM> nope

08:15 <KathrynM> Once it's on the server, it's out of your hands.

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08:16 <Agiofws> so i can stop contributing ?

08:16 <Agiofws> or what are my  benefits of contributing ?

08:17 <KathrynM> You can stop, but the more computers working on your render, the faster it will get done.

08:18 <Agiofws> do i get something like credits ?  get a better priority ? or something ?

08:19 <KathrynM> You get BOINC credits.

08:19 <Agiofws> which translate to ?

08:19 <desti> carma

08:20 <KathrynM> bragging rights :)

08:20 <CoderForLife> Linden Dollars

08:21 <CoderForLife> j/k

08:21 <CoderForLife> no one has established the exchange rate, plus no one will surrender their credits

08:22 <KathrynM> their mine!  Mine!  MINE!!!!!!!!!!!

08:22 <KathrynM> they're even

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08:35 <Agiofws> bragging rights :)  ?

08:35 <Agiofws> BOINC credits  : what are they ?

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08:37 * Tank_Master slaps wdsmia_w around a bit with a large trout

08:37 <wdsmia_w> mornin to you to

08:38 <Tank_Master> morning?

08:38 <Tank_Master> sun isnt up yet

08:38 <Tank_Master> ;)

08:38 * KathrynM grabs Tank_Master's trout and throws it in a frying pan and makes dinner

08:38 * wdsmia_w goes to make coffee

08:47 * CoderForLife weeps because he is at w@#%

08:49 * wdsmia_w weeps because its Monday and he is at w@#%

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10:07 * KathrynM is away: I may still exist in an alternate reality...

10:45 <PovAddict> Agiofws: credits don't really give you anything...

10:45 <PovAddict> other than the right to say "I contributed more than you"

10:46 <Agiofws> ok

10:46 <PovAddict> wow 70% done

10:47 <Agiofws> are you rendering ?

10:47 <PovAddict> nope, computer is busy with 5 other projects :)

10:48 <PovAddict> wow, 12-hour WCG workunit

10:59 <hawmps> PoV - wasn't someone working on making the tray icon changing color when there was completed work ready to send?

10:59 <Romulus> btw, you said you liked linux

11:16 <PovAddict> hmm I don't think so

11:17 <PovAddict> but... I'm not sure if apps can even change their tray icon on Linux

11:20 <desti> linux has no trays :-/

11:20 <PovAddict> exactly

11:20 <PovAddict> desktop environments provide tray icons at user request, but I don't think apps can fiddle with it

11:22 <DerMeister> There's also a rather strange bug on windows... ticket #586...

11:22 <PovAddict> &bticket 586

11:22 <Romulus>

11:22 <PovAddict> ah yeah

11:22 <DerMeister> Just looked into it and I have no idea what's wrong.

11:23 <DerMeister> SetIcon is called, abviously with a valid icon as the application *shows* the correct icon.

11:23 <PovAddict> does any other wxWidgets app do that?

11:23 <DerMeister> Nothing different compared to another wxWidgets application I wrote... But no such bug in my application

11:24 <DerMeister> I even removed the code for the tray icon because I feared that fiddling around with it might confuse windows. But same result...

11:24 <PovAddict> what if the icon doesn't have a 32x32 version?

11:24 <DerMeister> Hmm... is the standard boinc icon only 16x16 pixels?

11:25 <PovAddict> I dunno

11:25 * PovAddict gets resource hacker

11:26 <DerMeister> That might be an explanation

11:26 <DerMeister> It is indeed only 16x16 pixels whereas the icon of my application is 32x32 pixels

11:26 <PovAddict> nope

11:26 <PovAddict> 16x16, 32x32, 48x48

11:27 <DerMeister> the one used for the application icon is boinc.xpm... and that is a 16x16 pixel icon

11:27 <hawmps> kde does have a tray

11:27 <hawmps> but it's called a panel

11:27 <PovAddict> DerMeister: ohh, not boinc.ico with the multiple sizes? that explains it

11:28 <DerMeister> no, for compatibilities sake wxWidgets uses .xpm...

11:28 <PovAddict> so the Windows-format icon is only used for... the start menu?

11:28 <DerMeister> I just compiling the manager with a 32x32 bit icon (although not a boinc icon) to see if that fixes the bug

11:28 <hawmps> KSysTrayCmd

11:28 <DerMeister> I think so

11:29 <PovAddict> hrm something here is leaking resources

11:30 <PovAddict> "Gates sees next Windows 'sometime' in next year" (That should help Vista sales)

11:32 <DerMeister> hehe

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11:33 <DerMeister> OK, providing a 32x32 pixels icon really fixes this bug

11:33 <PovAddict> note you must use *both* sizes

11:34 <PovAddict> one for alt tab, the other for taskbar

11:34 <DerMeister> Are you sure? My application only has a 32x32 icon and it still works...

11:34 <Romulus> Then 5.10.45 for all.

11:34 <PovAddict> does it have an ugly-resized taskbar icon? :)

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11:35 <DerMeister> Well... it's small... hard to tell whether it would look better if it's only 16x16 pixels ;)

11:36 <DerMeister> Anyway - I see no way to set both icons...

11:36 <PovAddict> what source/line?

11:36 <DerMeister> At least not using wxWidgets

11:36 <DerMeister> AdvancedFrage.cpp:224

11:37 <PovAddict> frame? :)

11:37 <DerMeister> Ah, there is SetIcons... that one should help

11:37 <PovAddict> nope, the idea is seeing how wxIcon is initialized

11:37 <DerMeister> oh, yes, should be AdvancedFrame.cpp:244, sorry ;)

11:38 <PovAddict> if wxIcon's are like Windows HICON resources, they can probably have multiple sizes

11:39 <PovAddict> so the question is, what part of the code creates a new CAdvancedFrame?

11:40 <DerMeister> that should be in BOINCGUIApp.cpp:661

11:40 <DerMeister> but it uses the skin manager to get the icon

11:40 <desti> who is still using pixel graphics icons instead of vector graphics icons?

11:40 <DerMeister> desti: almost everyone not running vista ;)

11:40 <PovAddict> desti: almost everyone...? I don't think wx can do it anyway

11:43 <DerMeister> PovAddict: SkinManager.cp:991 uses the xpm icon and passes it as default icon to an CSkinIcon instance... And this one uses it in SkinManager.cpp:289 to create the wxIcon...

11:43 <DerMeister> m_icoIcon = wxIcon(m_ppDefaultIcon);

11:43 <Romulus> and to make an iso

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11:44 <DerMeister> I think just using a 32x32 pixels icon should solve the bug. Hoever, if still both versions should be used things might get a little tricky

11:45 <DerMeister> wxWidgets can handle this but the SkinManager not.

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11:46 <PovAddict> wxWidgets can handle multiple icon sizes in the way we need it?

11:46 <DerMeister> yes

11:46 <DerMeister>

11:46 <Romulus> <> (at

11:46 <DerMeister> just use this function instead of SetIcon

11:47 <PovAddict> ahh IconBundle, a different class...

11:47 <DerMeister> I never tried it but the documentation says it works

11:47 <DerMeister> Yes, and that's why it gets tricky with the SkinManager

11:48 <desti>

11:48 <Romulus> Title: wxMathPlot: wxMathPlot (at

11:48 <PovAddict> pretty mess

11:48 <PovAddict> well, at least now we know how to solve it

11:49 <DerMeister> I think just providing a 32x32 pixel icon should be enough. Not perfect but easy to "implement" and better than the current situation

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12:03 <DerMeister> damn... the 32x32 bit version really looks bad when displayed in the taskbar...

12:04 <DerMeister> Seems like there is no way around modifying the skin manager to load both icons...

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12:23 <eyen> my boinc is trying to micro 3 work units at once on a dual core cpu

12:24 <eyen> hopefully it fixes itself after it finishes them xD

12:30 <DerMeister> Hah... SetIcons really works...

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12:47 <DerMeister> Ok, I submitted a patch for bug #586...

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13:12 * Tank_Master is listening to: Ministry Of Sound - Trance Nation 4 (Mixed By Ferry Corsten) - Disc 1

13:13 <PovAddict> DerMeister: I wonder if that would cause problems...

13:13 <Tank_Master> BOINC IS a problem

13:13 <DerMeister> It worked for me on XP... I can't test other windows versions, though

13:14 <PovAddict> line 224, icon bundle gets created; line 227, it gets passed to SetIcons... wouldn't it cause problems when the method ends and the bundle gets destructed?

13:14 <PovAddict> does SetIcons keep a pointer to it...?

13:15 <DerMeister> Well, didn't see any problem. The documentation isn't clear at this point. It says that SetIcon creates a copy of the icon but it doesn't say anything like that for SetIcons

13:21 <yoyo[RKN]> hi

13:24 <DerMeister> Hm... Obviously SetIcon just calles SetIcons

13:26 <DerMeister> PovAddict: I just looked through the wx source code. SetIcons creates a copy of the icons bundle passed to that function.

13:26 <DerMeister> Therefore there should be no problem.

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13:38 <Tank_Master> yoyoyo

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13:38 <yoyo[RKN]> jojo

13:38 <Tank_Master> mojo

13:40 <PovAddict> &math convert 7200 seconds to hours

13:40 <Romulus> PovAddict: 2

13:41 <PovAddict> &google calc 5e15 / 2128620882.925060

13:41 <Romulus> PovAddict: 5e15 / 2,128,620,882.925060 = 2,348,938.71

13:42 <PovAddict> &math convert [math calc 5e15 / 2128620882.925060] seconds to hours

13:42 <Romulus> PovAddict: Error: invalid syntax (<string>, line 1)

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13:42 <PovAddict> &math convert [math calc 5000000000000000 / 2128620882.925060] seconds to hours

13:42 <Romulus> PovAddict: 652.482976197

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13:44 <PovAddict> &google calc 1e8 bytes to MB

13:44 <Romulus> PovAddict: 1e8 bytes = 95.3674316 megabytes

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14:32 <Tank_Master> &math convert 25 mmsq to insq

14:32 <Romulus> Tank_Master: Error: mmsq is not a valid unit.

14:32 <Tank_Master> &math convert 25 mm2 to in2

14:32 <Romulus> Tank_Master: Error: mm2 is not a valid unit.

14:32 <Tank_Master> mm square

14:33 <Tank_Master> &math convert 25 "mm square" to "in square"

14:33 <Romulus> Tank_Master: Error: mmsquare is not a valid unit.

14:33 <Tank_Master> grrr

14:33 <PovAddict> &units area

14:33 <Romulus> PovAddict: area units: square meter, are, hectare, acre, section, township, homestead, circular inch, circular mil

14:37 <Tank_Master> &math convert 25 square mm to square in

14:37 <Romulus> Tank_Master: Error: square is not a valid unit.

14:37 <Tank_Master> &math convert 25 "square mm" to "square in"

14:37 <Romulus> Tank_Master: Error: squaremm is not a valid unit.

14:37 <PovAddict> Romulus doesn't understand either

14:37 <Romulus> I have no idea, PovAddict.

14:38 <PovAddict> &google calc 25 square mm in square inches

14:38 <Romulus> PovAddict: 25 (square millimeters) = 0.0387500775 square inches

14:38 <hawmps> &math convert 25 mm2 to sqin

14:38 <Romulus> hawmps: Error: mm2 is not a valid unit.

14:38 <hawmps> &math convert 25 sqmm to sqin

14:38 <Romulus> hawmps: Error: sqmm is not a valid unit.

14:38 <PovAddict> they aren't listed in "area units"...

14:38 <hawmps> I thought the shorthand worked for that one

14:39 <Tank_Master> el piece of crappo

14:40 <hawmps> &list units

14:40 <Romulus> hawmps: Error: 'units' is not a valid plugin.

14:41 <hawmps> &math convert list units

14:41 <Romulus> hawmps: Error: list is not a valid unit.

14:41 <PovAddict> &units

14:41 <Romulus> PovAddict: valid types: mass, length, time, scheduling, temperature, temp. diff., current, charge, potential, resistance, conductance, capacitance, magn. flux, inductance, flux density, molecular qty, size of a mol, lum. intens., luminous flux, illuminance, luminance, angle, solid angle, data, data transfer, quantity, interest rate, concentration, force, area, volume, velocity, rot. velocity, fluid flow, gas (1 more message)

14:41 <hawmps> god forbid someone should try to figure something out themselves...

14:42 <PovAddict> god forbid someone should try to help...

14:43 <CoderForLife> &seen god

14:43 <Romulus> CoderForLife: god was last seen in #boinc 2 years, 18 weeks, 1 day, 7 hours, 40 minutes, and 4 seconds ago: <god> why have you summoned me from my holy grail?

14:44 <Tank_Master> LOL

14:44 <CoderForLife> seems like he's out of the picture

14:44 <CoderForLife> go for it

14:51 <hawmps> there was a great video about "help"

14:51 * CoderForLife and wdsmia_w weep together

14:52 <hawmps> seems everyone though the kid was trying to "help" himself to a older ladies purse...

14:52 <hawmps> what he was really doing was helping her out of the way of an oncoming bus...

14:53 <CoderForLife> no good deed goes unpunished

14:53 <hawmps> indeed

14:53 <CoderForLife> did they also reward the non-participants?

14:53 <hawmps> unknown..

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14:54 <CoderForLife> couldn't have been a project team, then

14:54 <CoderForLife> the first thing we do here is assign blame

14:55 <CoderForLife> the beating, er meeting, goes downhill from there

14:56 <CoderForLife> and we have been named to the "100 Best Places to W@#%" a couple of times

14:56 <Romulus> New news from boinc: BOINC news Apr 7, 2008

14:57 <CoderForLife> if this is "best", I pity others

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14:57 <CoderForLife> thank goodness we don't drive forklifts

14:58 <PovAddict> NEZ reached 1M RAC

14:58 <CoderForLife> NEZ = nose?

14:58 <PovAddict>

14:58 <Romulus> <> (at

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14:59 <CoderForLife> a megaRAC

15:00 * CoderForLife stares at the ceiling (because he lacks a window) and dreams

15:01 <CoderForLife> pretty impressive

15:02 * CoderForLife gets back to w@#%

15:02 <CoderForLife> later

15:08 <Tank_Master> tc

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15:34 <jackygrahamez> Bonjour

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15:40 <yoyo[RKN]> hehe jack

15:41 <PovAddict> I'm seriously considering starting to charge for server-related help

15:42 <yoyo[RKN]> ;)

15:43 <yoyo[RKN]> you are the only one who provides such help, nobody of the other experts is here

15:47 <jackygrahamez> Pov do you have a website where I can give you donations?

15:48 <PovAddict> I once created a paypal account...

15:48 <PovAddict> just for somebody to pay me 10 bucks for some little web dev I did

15:48 <Romulus> KathrynM: did you use BOINC Manager?

15:48 <PovAddict> months later paypal made my account disappear

15:48 <jackygrahamez> too bad

15:49 <PovAddict> no notification, no nothing... just "user doesn't exist" when logging in

15:49 <jackygrahamez> I would give you a little money for past assistance

15:49 <jackygrahamez> Not too much, I got a mortgage to pay

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16:33 <xcamel> re-hi

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17:18 <Tank_Master> hiya xcamel

17:24 <wdsmia> re-hi

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17:29 <wdsmia> &wx 50265

17:29 <Romulus> wdsmia: Temperature: 56.1F / 13.4C | Humidity: 30% | Pressure: 29.98in / 1015.1hPa (Steady) | Conditions: Mostly Cloudy | Wind Direction: WNW | Wind Speed: 7.6mph / 12.2km/h ; Tonight - Cloudy. A slight chance of rain showers in the evening... then a chance of rain after midnight. Low in the upper 30s. West wind 5 to 10 mph shifting to the north after midnight. Chance of precipitation 50 percent.; Tuesday - (1 more message)

17:29 <wdsmia> &more

17:29 <Romulus> wdsmia: Rain showers. High in the upper 40s. Northeast wind 10 to 15 mph. Chance of showers 80 percent.; Tuesday Night - Mostly cloudy in the evening then becoming partly cloudy. Low in the lower 30s. Northwest wind 5 to 15 mph.;

17:34 * KathrynM yawns

17:34 * KathrynM is back (gone 07:26:19)

17:34 * PovAddict is back too

17:41 <xcamel> interesting:

17:41 <xcamel>

17:41 <Romulus> Title: APOD: 2008 April 7 - Mysterious White Rock Fingers on Mars (at

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17:46 <Ageless> so much for testing 6.1.14 then...

17:46 <PovAddict> .15 out? lol

17:46 <Ageless> it doesn't recognize my SP4 either. :(

17:47 <PovAddict> ah great

17:47 <KathrynM> details details

17:47 <Romulus> jackygrahamez_: ah you had my hostname, you could let setting total_credit to anything :)

17:47 <Ageless> one of these days BOINC will be XP only... mark my words

17:48 <KathrynM> just wait, Windows 7 is supposed to be out in the next year

17:48 <Ageless> then again... Microsoft just said that they'll keep XP available for the following 2 years, so we can easily agree that Vista stinks ;)

17:48 <KathrynM> yup

17:48 <xcamel> the only life beyond XP is Linux.

17:49 <KathrynM> :D

17:49 <PovAddict> "Gates sees next Windows 'sometime' in next year -- That should help Vista sales"

17:50 <Ageless> now I wrestled myself through the Wiki conversation on the email lists... you don't really think it'll ever be updated after you got it off the ground, do you?

17:55 <Ageless> well, that killed the conversation... I'll go back to bed then

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18:05 <desti>

18:05 <Romulus> <> (at

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18:25 <xcamel> re-back

18:27 <xcamel> Ancient tools unearthed in Australia

18:27 <xcamel> SYDNEY, Australia - Tools dating back at least 35,000 years have been unearthed in a rock shelter in Australia's remote northwest, making it one of the oldest archaeological finds in that part of the country, archaeologists said Monday.

18:27 <xcamel> wow-za

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18:30 <xcamel> wb Doug

18:31 <wdsmia> rebooting every few weeks is a good idea

18:31 <wdsmia> *lo Jay ready for Friday?

18:38 <xcamel> little by little

18:38 <KathrynM> I have tomorrow off, so today is a Friday for me.

18:38 <KathrynM> Unfortunately Thursday is Monday.  But then I get another Friday

18:39 <xcamel> the aheader you go, the behinder you get...

18:39 <xcamel> today ended up being a really nice day finally...

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18:57 <CoderForLife> evening, boinclanders

18:57 <wdsmia> *lo Don

18:57 <CoderForLife> hey Doug

18:57 <CoderForLife> just got in from a walk around the bottom and then up the hill

18:58 <CoderForLife> that's a tough climb

18:58 <CoderForLife> muddy slopes averaging 45 degrees

18:58 <wdsmia> fun

18:59 <CoderForLife> 3 trees fell below the house since yesterday

18:59 <xcamel> uh-oh

18:59 <CoderForLife> 2 of them right on the creek

18:59 <xcamel> seems it would have drained by now..

18:59 <CoderForLife> one of them about 10 feet from the crest of the hill, one of "my" trees

19:00 <CoderForLife> it had been severely bent over by weather, and it's roots were right on the "fault line"

19:00 <CoderForLife> the bent over top pulled it over

19:00 <xcamel> ouch

19:01 <CoderForLife> my wife said it made a huge noise

19:01 <CoderForLife> I bet

19:01 <xcamel> all oak trees, right?

19:02 <CoderForLife> I had to use the fallen tree as kind of a giant had rail to climb the hill

19:02 <CoderForLife> nah - I mixed bad of deciduous trees

19:02 <CoderForLife> beech, maple, walnut

19:02 <CoderForLife> an oak here and there

19:02 <CoderForLife> ash

19:03 <CoderForLife> there's about 4 to 6 inches of leaf cover on top of the mud

19:03 <CoderForLife> that both helps and hurts

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19:03 *** tamar is now known as BiteAbleKat

19:04 <CoderForLife> any way - I went down to get another perspective on my issue

19:04 <CoderForLife> the slippage contjnues generally across my whole back yard. albeit just slightly lower on the hill

19:05 <CoderForLife> not so visible from the top

19:05 <CoderForLife> but grossly evident from below

19:06 <KathrynM>

19:06 <Romulus> <> (at

19:06 <KathrynM> 2 of my students

19:06 <xcamel> get some swamp grass seed... it has huge root systems..

19:06 <CoderForLife> you've turned your students into a web page?!

19:06 <KathrynM> lol

19:07 <CoderForLife> they're cute - they don't seem like trouble...

19:07 <KathrynM> ha!

19:07 <xcamel> they are cute..

19:07 <KathrynM> the cute ones are the biggest hellions

19:07 <xcamel> go figure..

19:08 <CoderForLife> what's the "two" for?  Two seconds until trouble starts?

19:08 <KathrynM> lol

19:08 <KathrynM> All Koreans do the peace sign in pictures.  I have NO idea why.

19:08 <KathrynM> strange country

19:09 <CoderForLife> Americans do the #1 sign

19:09 * CoderForLife wonders if that what that really means

19:10 <CoderForLife> does swamp grass require much sun, xcamel?

19:12 <xcamel> nope - it grows almost anywhere too

19:12 <xcamel> crown vetch, witchgrass etc

19:16 <CoderForLife> mom just called - sister had a bad day today

19:16 <PovAddict> :o

19:16 <CoderForLife> I need to drop off and de-stress for awhile

19:16 <CoderForLife> cya folks later

19:16 <KathrynM> laters

19:17 <wdsmia> cya

19:17 * CoderForLife is really away now

19:19 * KathrynM is away: I may still exist in an alternate reality...

19:36 * xcamel needs to de-stress in beautiful mexico

19:36 <Agiofws> could someone tell me if burp is working  ok  things are kinda slow now

19:37 <xcamel> their website could give you the status, IIRC

19:38 <xcamel>

19:38 <Romulus> Title: Server status page (at

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19:39 <zombie67> got 3 spiders

19:39 <Romulus> They are only sorted when needed...

19:40 <wdsmia> well step on them zombie67 :P

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19:47 <xcamel> Zom-Bony!

19:48 <zombie67> hi xcamel

19:48 <xcamel> how goes it?

19:49 <zombie67> nice and quiet

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20:13 <xcamel> bac from milk and coffee run

20:13 <xcamel> er back even..

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20:15 <xcamel> 'lo Ed

20:16 <efc> Hey

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20:21 <xcamel> wazzup?

20:22 <efc> Not much, bought the Stargate DVD

20:22 <xcamel> watch it yet?

20:22 <efc> Nope

20:22 <efc> Might save it for the weekend

20:22 <xcamel> need to remember to do that..

20:23 <efc> Be proud of me. I paid $3 extra, just to get it over with.

20:23 <xcamel> woha.. big spender..

20:25 <efc> I should have spent more on my movie poster too, since it looks like it will cost me $50 to get a reasonably decent frame and mount for it.

20:25 <efc> (My poster had a slight ding but it was only $16 or so)

20:31 <xcamel> got a link to the sales pages?

20:31 <efc> Poster, or frame?

20:32 <xcamel> dvd

20:33 <efc>

20:33 <Romulus> <> (at

20:42 <xcamel> thanks.

20:56 <xcamel> &weather 12074

20:56 <Romulus> xcamel: Temperature: 48.0F / 8.9C | Humidity: 42% | Pressure: 30.33in / 1027.0hPa (Rising) | Conditions: Clear | Wind Direction: SSE | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Overnight - Partly cloudy. Lows in the lower 30s. Southeast winds 5 to 10 mph.; Tuesday - Mostly sunny. Highs in the lower 60s. Southeast winds 5 to 10 mph.; Tuesday Night - Partly cloudy. Lows in the mid 30s. Southeast winds around 5 mph.;

20:56 <xcamel> nice and short

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21:13 <xcamel> 'lo Ben

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21:28 <Tank_Master>

21:28 <Romulus> Title: YouTube - 360° Light Field Display (at

21:30 <Soul_keeper> "AMD plans to axe off 1,600 employees before the close of September -- this would represent a 10% reduction in AMD's current workforce of 16,000 employees."

21:30 <Soul_keeper> Last year, Santa Clara-based Intel cut about 10,500 jobs, or about 10 percent of its work force, in a move to save about $3 billion annually.

21:36 <xcamel> damn, that it cool..

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22:08 <PovAddict> any idea how to change the default boot OS in grub?

22:10 * Tank_Master refrains from saying "install windows"

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23:03 <KathrynM> PovAddict, try changing the order in grub.conf

23:03 <KathrynM> I think the default is the first listed

23:03 <PovAddict> I looked at the config for Windows XP

23:03 <PovAddict> it has a "savedefault" line on it

23:03 <PovAddict> which apparently is supposed to make it the default if you select it

23:04 <KathrynM> I have  nothing like that.

23:04 <Romulus> drags CoderForLife back by the way:

23:04 <PovAddict> essentially making the default "the one you chose last time"

23:04 <PovAddict> ...but it doesn't seem to be working...

23:04 <KathrynM>

23:04 <KathrynM> that's mine

23:04 <Romulus> Title: general pastebin - Untitled - post number 976374 (at

23:05 <PovAddict> I don't think I can see mine from Winduhs

23:05 <KathrynM> prob  not

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23:34 <ework> I'm seeing a very strange error on my linux x86 system

23:34 <PovAddict> I'll bbl, sorry

23:34 <ework> from what I've read most projects support x86 linux

23:34 <PovAddict> Didactylos: take note of his error for the docs ;-)

23:35 <ework> I'm trying to attach to World Community grid project

23:35 *** hawmps has quit IRC

23:35 <ework> the errors of interest are

23:35 <ework> Mon 07 Apr 2008 08:16:12 PM PDT|World Community Grid|[error] App version has unsupported platform i686-pc-linux-gnu

23:35 <ework> Mon 07 Apr 2008 08:16:12 PM PDT|World Community Grid|[error] No app version for result: i686-pc-linux-gnu 519

23:36 <Didactylos> I know this one.

23:36 <Didactylos> Let me think.

23:37 <ework> based on that it appears to me that i686-pc-linux-gnu is not supported, correct?

23:37 <ework> but it should be based on what I've seen in forums

23:37 <Didactylos> Yes, it's supported.

23:38 <ework> maybe I forgot some setting, I'm an experienced linux user but a newbie to Boinc

23:39 <ework> a google search and some forum searches came up with no matches for "unsupported platform i686-pc-linux-gnu"

23:39 <ework> so now I'm here

23:39 <KathrynM> that's how mine reports...

23:39 <KathrynM> 2008-04-08 04:15:34 [---] Starting BOINC client version 5.10.21 for i686-pc-linux-gnu

23:39 <KathrynM> Didactylos, want me to try to attach right quick?

23:39 <Didactylos> Do you use a 64bit Linux?

23:39 <ework> Mon 07 Apr 2008 08:08:51 PM PDT||Starting BOINC client version 5.10.45 for i386-pc-linux-gnu

23:39 <ework> thats mine from messages line 1

23:39 <KathrynM> that's why

23:39 <KathrynM> you're reporting i386 instead of i686

23:40 <KathrynM> How did you install BOINC?

23:40 <ework> weird, its a core 2 duo

23:40 <ework> from the fedora package

23:40 <KathrynM> that's a bug

23:40 <KathrynM> hold on

23:40 <ework> using yum

23:40 <ework> is that changeable from a config file or does it require a recompile?

23:41 <Didactylos> ework: You can use the altplatform mechanism to get work.

23:41 <Didactylos> See this post:

23:41 <Romulus> <> (at

23:41 <ework> ok

23:41 <ework> let me try that and get back to you

23:41 <KathrynM> no, it's easier than that

23:41 <KathrynM> hold one while i restart ff

23:42 <Didactylos> Easier than what?

23:42 <KathrynM> there's an updated package

23:42 <KathrynM> that reports itself correctly

23:42 <Didactylos> Ah. A *fixed* bug.

23:42 <KathrynM> I was in touch with Milos and Eric about it

23:42 <Didactylos> My favourite kind.

23:42 <Romulus> almost feeling in my feet in

23:43 <ework> so wait should I fetch and updated package

23:43 <Didactylos> Yes.

23:43 <KathrynM>

23:43 <Romulus> Title: general pastebin - Someone - post number 976407 (at

23:43 <ework> from fedora rawhide or somewhere else?

23:43 <KathrynM> gotta go back to w*#$

23:43 <KathrynM> laterz

23:45 <ework> ok i see a new version for devel but I need some other dependencies first libcrypto and libssl

23:47 <Didactylos> Either wait for KathrynM to get back, or just use the cc_config workaround.

23:47 <ework> ok well thats not going to work, the newer packages uses a new version of openssl and that causes other problems

23:51 <Didactylos> cc_config will get you going fastest.

23:51 <ework> yah trying that now

23:51 <ework> I'll just have to watch for updates to boinc

23:52 <ework> well the first line is still the same

23:53 <PovAddict> yes that's expected

23:53 <ework> ok

23:53 <PovAddict> your BOINC used to ask for "a i386-pc-linux-gnu app"

23:53 <PovAddict> now it will ask for "a i386-pc-linux-gnu app, or alternatively, i686-pc-linux-gnu"

23:55 <ework> ah

23:55 <ework> makes sense

23:55 <ework> it seems to be downloading some i686 specific files

23:57 <ework> ok the cpu seems to be going now

23:57 <PovAddict> \o/

23:58 <ework> but it doesn't seem to be using both cpus when idle

23:58 <ework> it jumps around a lot and from cpu to cpu but at least its going now

23:58 <Romulus> actually rommie, it's 0827

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