IRC logs of #boinc for Thursday, 2008-12-11

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01:15 <FreeLarry58> &wx 98366

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01:15 <Romulus> FreeLarry58: Temperature: 44.6F / 7.0C | Humidity: 96% | Pressure: 30.54in / 1034.1hPa (Rising) | Conditions: Overcast | Wind Direction: North | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Tonight - Mostly cloudy. Lows in the mid 30s to lower 40s. North wind to 10 mph.; Thursday - Mostly cloudy with patchy morning fog...becoming partly sunny. Highs in the 40s. North wind to 10 mph.; Thursday Night - Mostly (1 more message)

01:16 <FreeLarry58> &more

01:16 <Romulus> FreeLarry58: cloudy. Lows in the 30s to lower 40s. Light wind.;

01:36 <Soul_keeper> &wx 91977

01:36 <Romulus> Soul_keeper: Temperature: 46.6F / 8.1C | Humidity: 39% | Pressure: 29.74in / 1007.0hPa (Steady) | Conditions: Clear | Wind Direction: ENE | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Rest of Tonight - Mostly clear. Lows 43 to 53. Light winds.; Thursday - Mostly sunny. Highs 76 to 81. Light winds.; Thursday Night - Partly cloudy. Lows 46 to 54. Light winds.; Special Weather Statement for San Diego County in (1 more message)

01:37 <FreeLarry58> looks close Soul_keeper - but they hinting at lowland snowfall over weekend here

01:37 <FreeLarry58> your highs definitely nicer

01:37 <Soul_keeper> my dad just got back from a trip

01:38 <Soul_keeper> from kansas, guess he drove thru new mexico  said it was snowing there

01:38 <FreeLarry58> been snowing in mountains for a while around here too

01:38 <FreeLarry58> almost time for ski resorts to start opening

01:39 <Soul_keeper> :)

01:39 <FreeLarry58> well back to working ofn figuring out this sim game again

01:39 <Soul_keeper> yeah i'm bout to crash here

01:42 <Soul_keeper> &math convert 1 mile to feet

01:42 <Romulus> Soul_keeper: 5280

01:59 <efc> moo

02:07 <Soul_keeper> google maps is absolutely amazing

02:18 <efc> Bailout Bill Passes House, super

02:18 <mchelen1> as long as we bailed out the financial industry might as well bail out the rest...

02:19 * efc sets a pile of money on fire

02:19 <mchelen1> but the important question is not if they are bailed but under what terms

02:22 <efc> &wx 31088

02:22 <Romulus> efc: Temperature: 63F / 17C | Humidity: 100% | Pressure: 29.81in / 1010hPa (Falling) | Conditions: Light Rain | Wind Direction: SE | Wind Speed: 6mph / 9km/h ; Rest of Tonight - Occasional rain with a chance of thunderstorms in the evening...then occasional showers with a chance of thunderstorms after midnight. Some thunderstorms may be severe with heavy rainfall after midnight. Lows in the mid (2 more messages)

02:22 <efc> &more

02:22 <Romulus> efc: 60s. Southeast winds 5 to 15 mph. Chance of rain near 100 percent.; Thursday - Occasional showers with a chance of thunderstorms in the morning...then a chance of showers in the afternoon. Some thunderstorms may be severe with heavy rainfall. Highs in the mid 60s. Southeast winds 15 to 20 mph shifting to the southwest in the afternoon. Chance of rain near 100 percent.; Thursday Night - Mostly (1 more message)

02:22 <efc> &more

02:22 <Romulus> efc: cloudy with a 20 percent chance of showers in the evening. Windy. Much colder. Lows in the mid 30s. West winds 10 to 20 mph.; Areal Flood Watch for Houston County in effect until 12:00 PM EST on December 11, 2008; Wind Advisory for Houston County in effect until 2:00 AM EST on December 12, 2008;

03:12 *** weedeater has joined #boinc

03:21 <weedeater> hello

03:21 <efc> moo

03:22 <weedeater> I have some questions

03:23 <efc> shoot

03:28 <weedeater> I saw a while back on Universe or one of those shows that radio waves would play out before they got, I think even to the next star.

03:29 <weedeater> Or some such

03:29 <weedeater> If so why are we still listening for them?

03:29 <efc> its a complicated topic, but basically a high power, high gain, directional antenna can be received by another large, high gain antenna

03:30 <weedeater> I see

03:30 <efc> SETI@Home is basically going for somebody trying to contact us on purpose

03:30 <efc> Arebico can detect another Arebico out to something like 100 LY

03:31 <weedeater> How many stars within 100 LY?

03:31 <efc> hundreds, maybe thousands

03:31 <weedeater> ok

03:32 <efc> It could detect higher power stuff even further

03:32 <efc> however they have to be fairly persistent for us to pick them up

03:32 <efc> if not you get a fluke like the Wow signal that can't be confirmed

03:33 <weedeater> Oh yeah, I forgot all about the wow

03:34 <efc> we have a radio astronomy guy over at #astronomy if you're interested in more depth

03:35 <weedeater> Ok, also using directional antenae someone trying to make contact could spend much time pointing in all directions out from their planet, yes?

03:37 <efc> No, they would have to cover a tiny piece of sky at a time

03:37 <mchelen1> depends if their technology is equal to ours ;)

03:37 <efc> Without violating conservation of energy, gain is going to be at the cost of directivity

03:38 <weedeater> That's what I mean, a piece at a time = much time to find us

03:38 <efc> You've got so many watts and they go further if put into the smallest beamwidth

03:39 <mchelen1> think of the techniques that could advance this... what about sending a 1 second signal repeating every 10 seconds?

03:39 <efc> the way our search works they almost have to continuously illuminate us..

03:40 <efc> they could probably do something like that and we might still pick it up

03:40 <mchelen1> if they had 10,000 huge radio dishes maybe it would be possible to cover every planet within 100ly

03:41 <weedeater> if we can only reach 1000s of stars and have to be pointing at the one that is pointing at us likely hood seems small

03:41 <mchelen1> its not possible to change the amount of energy radio uses still some technology could advance it significantly

03:41 <mchelen1> or more funding :D

03:41 <efc> maybe energy is cheap to them

03:41 <mchelen1> weedeater, exactly so it depends if what we are looking for has less than, equal to, or greater technology

03:42 <efc> then they could broadcast omni I suppose

03:42 <mchelen1> right maybe, or with better astronomy can predict which planets would sustain life

03:42 <weedeater> I'm sure we'll get there

03:42 <efc> Sure, its possible that maybe radio is a fleeting stage in technological development

03:42 <mchelen1> its like a person walking past a slug though, do we stop and try to talk with it?

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03:43 <efc> moo linear_shift.. I was just explaining, the current SETI methods more or less require ET to be pointing their narrow beam at us some substantial fraction of the time..

03:44 <mchelen1> well steam power was novel at some point, still it has specialized uses today

03:44 <efc> linear_shift has looked at a nearly-full sky antenna.. but nothing on the Arebico scale has been built yet.

03:45 <mchelen1> someone with not much more technology than ours could operate radio arrays across several planets or satellites

03:46 <weedeater> Do we have plans to put antenae in space?

03:46 <efc> Don't think so, there's not much need

03:47 <mchelen1> it seems plausible that they would be interested in finding other life just like us, so maybe one day we will be able to detect each other

03:47 <efc> Maybe on the far side of the moon to block interference, but thats about it

03:47 <mchelen1> probably wont be economical for a long time

03:47 <linear_shift> no not unless you aspire to observe in an atmosphere absorbing band

03:47 <efc> the ground based ones are pretty good in general, atmosphere doesn't attenuate RF much

03:47 <linear_shift> like oxygen or something

03:47 <mchelen1> imagine if you could have a 10km radio dish that unfolds in space

03:48 <linear_shift>

03:48 <Romulus> Title: Kurtis Miller's (Radio) Astronomy Adventures (at

03:48 <linear_shift> :)

03:48 <mchelen1> maybe the most useful thing is the analysis techniques to look at the data though

03:48 <linear_shift> might do UHF SETI with it

03:48 <efc> I was watching this idiotic BBC special on a manned mission to Pluto. They put out a telescope to search for alien life there. Not sure why they had to send warm butts all the way to Pluto to do that :p

03:48 <efc> Pimp My Blog eh :)

03:48 <efc> or Your blog

03:48 <mchelen1> try to find a plutonian ;D

03:49 <mchelen1> the probes are getting pretty impressive though

03:49 <efc> That special should have been called Mission To Kill The Crew For $5 Trillion

03:49 <linear_shift> efc: trying to get the word out man :)

03:49 <linear_shift> pluto express?

03:49 <efc> Say it gets all kinds of wack porn channels, that'll garner interest

03:50 <weedeater> what? there's no manned missions to pluto

03:50 <efc> This hypothetical mission was to venus (they landed - dumb) through the solar atmosphere (....) to mars, then jupiter (land on Io), then through saturns rings (..) then pluto to deploy some stinking 12 " telescope

03:51 <linear_shift> pluto express is unmanned

03:51 <weedeater> oh

03:51 <efc> There are some thoughts on optical SETI, btw, I don't know the pros and cons off the top of my head

03:52 <efc> using lasers and such

03:52 <linear_shift>

03:52 <Romulus> Title: The Columbus Optical SETI Observatory (COSETI Observatory) - The Optical Search for Extraterrestrial Intelligence (at

03:52 <weedeater> yeah I was reading about the probe yesterday after watching the show about the man who killed pluto

03:52 <efc> It would be awfully nice if you could just see a blinking light..

03:52 <linear_shift> you use PMTs

03:52 <linear_shift> photomultiplier tubes

03:53 <linear_shift> hella dangerous, as they use a 1000V supply

03:53 <efc> Is there any reason you can't have a radio laser? (Raser?)

03:53 <weedeater> I don't know much about this stuff, but this light signal stuff sounds promising

03:54 <linear_shift> efc: yeah, a really high gain antenna ;)

03:54 <linear_shift> as far as emmision laser

03:54 <weedeater> same problem though, very directional

03:54 <linear_shift> there are phenomena in the universe known as masers

03:55 <efc> at some point, you want super duper directional, or not very directional.. even a narrow beam like Arebico wastes a lot of power if you know the spot you want to illuminate

03:55 <linear_shift> in spectral band

03:55 <efc> not that lasers are perfect eaither

03:55 <efc> oh yeah, i forgot about masers, duh

03:55 <linear_shift> like the oh

03:55 <linear_shift> oh

03:56 <weedeater> for finding I think wide is the thing then narrow for talking

03:56 <linear_shift>

03:56 <Romulus> Title: Ohio Argus Array - Main Page (at

03:57 <efc> the usable bit rate at such ranges is really low, like 1 baud or somewhere around there

03:57 <linear_shift> from those who brought you the big ear (BERO)

03:57 <efc> as far as trying to convey information goes

03:57 <weedeater> I fear if we can only reach 1000+ stars it's not far enough

03:58 * linear_shift tries to recall where they sent the Arecibo message

03:58 <efc> Hercules

03:58 <efc> M81 I think

03:58 <linear_shift> M81?

03:58 <efc> the great cluster in Hercules, globular cluster

03:58 <linear_shift> yes i know

03:58 <linear_shift> took the letters right from my keyboard

03:59 <efc> I had stated an Arebico could talk to another Arebico for about 100 LY, linear_shift might have some more thoughts on that..

03:59 <linear_shift> hold on

03:59 <efc> M81 is wrong

04:00 <linear_shift>

04:00 <Romulus> Title: SETI Spreadsheet Templates (at

04:00 <efc> M13, thats it

04:00 <ELGono> i thought it was leo

04:01 <linear_shift> thats another globular

04:01 <linear_shift> why globulars? old ass objects, not real likely to have life supporting planets

04:02 <linear_shift> all red giants

04:02 <linear_shift> and some huge blue K types

04:02 <linear_shift> "blue stragglers"

04:03 <ELGono> In 1974, the Arecibo message, an attempt to communicate with extraterrestrial life, was transmitted from the radio telescope toward the globular cluster M13, about 25,000 light-years away.[

04:03 <linear_shift> oops O types

04:03 <ELGono> hehe

04:04 <weedeater> 25,000 out of range?

04:04 <ELGono> it still wonder what eta carinae hecks out

04:04 <ELGono> LBV

04:04 <linear_shift> any life in a habitable zone there woulda been fried billions of years ago

04:05 <efc> I don't think they were being very serious

04:06 <linear_shift> then why the hell did they send it

04:06 <linear_shift> ?

04:06 <efc> its not like they couldn't have spend $500 for the juice to send it to dozens of other places if they were actually trying

04:07 <ELGono> or they could send it once a day or week

04:07 <weedeater> I think at the time they thought it was not out of range

04:07 <ELGono> not once a lifetime

04:08 <weedeater> there isn't much funding for this sort of thing is there?

04:09 * linear_shift thinks he'll hijack some ham's EME array and beam a few dozen ET candidate stars

04:09 <efc> seti in general is pretty much all private

04:09 <linear_shift> allen array

04:09 <efc> govt was funding a pittance but cut it off around '93

04:09 <linear_shift> the SKA is gonna do some too

04:10 <ELGono> thats when seti@home was born

04:10 <linear_shift> yup

04:10 <ELGono> at least idea

04:10 <efc> Gotta get some sleep, later

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04:10 <linear_shift> their cutting arecibos funding iirc

04:10 <linear_shift> its bullshit

04:10 <ELGono> good night eddi

04:10 <wdsmia> asks linear_shift to please watch his or her language Thanks, your friendly channel op.

04:11 <linear_shift> wdsmia: ok

04:11 <linear_shift> sorry not used to this channel

04:11 <ELGono> :)

04:11 <weedeater> bye

04:11 <ELGono> laterz weedeater

04:12 <weedeater> I was sayin bye to efc

04:13 <weedeater> I missed

04:13 <CoderForLife> &wx 45140

04:13 <Romulus> CoderForLife: Temperature: 30.4F / -0.9C | Humidity: 100% | Pressure: 29.96in / 1014.4hPa (Falling) | Conditions: Overcast | Wind Direction: NNE | Wind Speed: 4.6mph / 7.4km/h ; Today - Mostly cloudy with isolated rain and snow showers this morning...then partly sunny this afternoon. Highs in the upper 30s. North winds 10 to 15 mph. Chance of precipitation 20 percent.; Tonight - Partly cloudy. (1 more message)

04:13 <CoderForLife> &more

04:13 <Romulus> CoderForLife: Lows in the mid 20s. North winds 10 to 15 mph.; Friday - Mostly cloudy with isolated snow showers. Highs in the mid 30s. Northwest winds around 10 mph. Chance of snow 20 percent.;

04:13 <linear_shift> efc's a big time user of this channel huh?

04:13 <CoderForLife> morning all

04:14 <weedeater> I dunno , first time for me

04:15 <CoderForLife> hello weedeater linear_shift

04:15 <weedeater> morning coder

04:15 <weedeater> I'm a little slow to much time on the mouse

04:16 <linear_shift> i know efc from ##astronomy

04:16 <weedeater> I'll check that room next time

04:17 <linear_shift> anyways you guys sound like an interesting group

04:17 <linear_shift> i gotta crash though, work tomorrow

04:17 <weedeater> see ya

04:18 <CoderForLife> cya linear_shift

04:18 <weedeater> sup coder

04:18 <CoderForLife> well - me - I just got up

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04:19 <weedeater> I'm almost ready to hit the couch

04:20 <weedeater> a buddy was talking about getting boinc today, thought I'd come ask some Q's

04:20 <CoderForLife> what did the couch do to you?  =)

04:20 <weedeater> lol

04:21 <weedeater> and get some irc time, pretty new to me

04:21 <CoderForLife> yeah, I was there once

04:22 <weedeater> so you do software?

04:22 <CoderForLife> ya think?

04:22 <weedeater> just a guess

04:22 <CoderForLife> I'm a Coder at heart =)

04:22 <weedeater> cool

04:23 <weedeater> spent my youth on less productive persuits

04:23 <CoderForLife> I sense some reference to age

04:23 <weedeater> 44

04:24 <weedeater> getting there

04:24 <CoderForLife> 51 here - got there  =)

04:24 <weedeater> ah

04:25 <weedeater> so what other cool things can boinc be used for, other than seti?

04:26 <CoderForLife> there's a large number of differenr projects

04:27 <weedeater> I need to spend some time on their webpage

04:27 <CoderForLife>

04:27 <Romulus> Title: Choosing BOINC projects (at

04:27 <weedeater> yeah got it bookmarked

04:27 <CoderForLife> we tend to get excited here when LHC@home work is available

04:28 <weedeater> LHC? was that ladder something I saw on wiki?

04:28 <CoderForLife> Large Hadron Collider

04:29 <weedeater> oh is that the new one?

04:29 <weedeater> did it go online?

04:29 <CoderForLife> yeah - they use BOINC to send out calculations to help fine-tune the machine

04:29 <CoderForLife> online - well, for a day or so

04:30 <CoderForLife> then it broke

04:30 <weedeater> bummer

04:30 <CoderForLife> it'll be back - it big and full of exotic technology - it was inevitable

04:31 <CoderForLife>

04:31 <weedeater> so they are trying to see what the universe looked like at birth right?

04:31 <CoderForLife> speak of the beast, I'm crunching some work currently

04:32 <CoderForLife> in essence, you are correct

04:32 <weedeater> that link isn't connecting

04:32 <CoderForLife> I have 13 WUs

04:34 <weedeater> I've got a cli only box with p3 and 128 in the other room just sitting there mostly

04:34 <weedeater> and this one sits at least 1\2 the day

04:35 <weedeater> still not connected to that link

04:36 <CoderForLife> looks like the web site *just* went down unfortunately - I can't access it either now

04:36 <weedeater> ah

04:38 <weedeater> well I'm going to go look at some of the projects for a bit before crashing nice talking to ya

04:39 <CoderForLife> ok tc

04:39 <CoderForLife> brb  breakfast

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06:37 <hawmps> boo

06:44 <CoderForLife> boo hoo

06:45 <CoderForLife> I'm takng the missus to the dentist and back this morning - late arrival at w@#%

06:51 <hawmps> hunkering down for the big storm

06:51 <CoderForLife> what's the forecast?

06:52 <hawmps> depends on where you live - 2" of ice to 24" of snow...

06:52 <CoderForLife> neither one is good

06:52 <CoderForLife> but I'd take the snow, I reckon

06:53 <CoderForLife> I hate ice

06:54 * Tank_Master wonders if 4AM is a good time to go to bed

06:54 <hawmps> ditto.

06:54 <Tank_Master> we may get snow this weekend here

06:56 <CoderForLife> we need better search engines - my search for "furniture dolly" yields "dolly furniture" - hardly what I meant

06:58 <Tank_Master> lol

07:00 <CoderForLife> I'll just go to the local U-Haul and rent 2 - I want to be able to move the washer and dryer around as I put up the cabinets on the wall behind them.  Using dollies will be a back-saving miracle.

07:05 <CoderForLife> rental place near w@#% shows them at $7 per day, $14 per week

07:06 <CoderForLife> the laundry room is small - it'll be quite a dance

07:07 <CoderForLife> about time to leave for the dentist

07:07 <CoderForLife> laterz

08:08 <hawmps> &wx 12020

08:08 <Romulus> hawmps: Temperature: 24.9F / -3.9C | Humidity: 85% | Pressure: 30.19in / 1022.2hPa (Falling) | Conditions: Light Snow | Wind Direction: ENE | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Today - Snow and sleet likely this morning...then sleet...snow... freezing rain and rain this afternoon. Snow and sleet accumulation up to an inch. Ice accumulation of up to one tenth of an inch. Highs in the lower 30s. North (3 more messages)

08:08 <hawmps> &more

08:08 <Romulus> hawmps: winds around 5 mph. Chance of precipitation near 100 percent.; Tonight - Freezing rain and sleet. Snow after midnight. Additional snow and sleet accumulation up to an inch. Ice accumulation around one half of an inch. Near steady temperature in the lower 30s. North winds 5 to 10 mph. Chance of precipitation near 100 percent.; Friday - Sleet...freezing rain...snow with a chance of rain (2 more messages)

08:08 <hawmps> &more

08:08 <Romulus> hawmps: showers in the morning...then partly sunny in the afternoon. Total snow accumulation of 1 to 3 inches. Ice accumulation of up to one tenth of an inch. Highs in the mid 30s. Northwest winds 10 to 15 mph with gusts up to 25 mph. Chance of precipitation near 100 percent.; Winter Storm Warning for Saratoga County in effect until 1:00 PM EST on December 12, 2008; Special Weather Statement for (1 more message)

08:08 <hawmps> &more

08:08 <Romulus> hawmps: Saratoga County in effect until 10:15 AM EST on December 11, 2008;

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08:31 <sata> any active user

08:31 <sata> i need some help

08:31 <hawmps> yes?

08:31 <Romulus> Somebody said yes is enable, hawmps

08:31 <sata> hi

08:31 <sata> how can i create a tem

08:31 <hawmps> what do you need?

08:31 <sata> team?

08:31 <sata> i want to create my own team in seti

08:32 <hawmps> depends on the original project, iirc.

08:32 <sata> ?

08:32 <hawmps> I think you can still create one from the main page of seti@home

08:33 <sata> i all ready had a account on seti

08:33 <sata> but now i want that people can see it as a team

08:33 <sata> so that they can join it

08:33 <sata> any idea

08:33 <sata> ?

08:33 <hawmps> team creation is on the same page - or used to be...

08:33 <sata> as i all ready search there is only option for joining the team but i need how to create a team

08:34 <hawmps> I think it reall says "join or create"

08:34 <hawmps> er really even...

08:34 <sata> can u give me the link to it

08:36 <sata> i think i get the link

08:36 <sata>

08:36 <Romulus> <> (at

08:37 <hawmps> that's the one..

08:38 <sata> thnaks

08:39 <sata> name of my team Doomsday of Phoenix

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13:24 <yoyo[RKN]> moin

13:24 <MTughan> 'lo yoyo

13:30 <Tank_Master> yo yoyo!

13:30 <Tank_Master> howdy MT

13:30 <MTughan> 'lo TM

13:31 <yoyo[RKN]> how can I cancel some wus

13:31 <yoyo[RKN]> some hundreds

13:31 <Tank_Master> reset project?

13:31 <yoyo[RKN]> on server side

13:31 <Tank_Master> ok

13:32 <Tank_Master> Id have no idea

13:32 <Tank_Master> just purge the entier DB?

13:51 <yoyo[RKN]> got it

13:51 <yoyo[RKN]> just set max_error to 0

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14:30 <yoyo[RKN]> stupid linux

14:30 <yoyo[RKN]> don't understand it

14:31 <yoyo[RKN]> why does this background process stops

14:31 <yoyo[RKN]> [1]+  Stopped                 netcat -ulp 9390 | epic -d -c \#rechenkraft yoyo_bot 2>&1 >

14:32 <PovAddict> are you running it in the background using &?

14:32 <yoyo[RKN]> yes

14:33 <yoyo[RKN]> netcat reseives something on udp port 9390 sends it to epic and epic to irc and than Stopped

14:34 <PovAddict> netcat constantly gets data from stdin

14:34 <PovAddict> since you aren't piping anything into netcat's stdin, it uses the keyboard

14:34 <PovAddict> you can't type data into a program's stdin if it's in the background

14:34 <PovAddict> so it stops

14:35 <yoyo[RKN]> but it should listen on port 9390

14:35 <PovAddict> netcat will send to stdout what it receives from that port

14:35 <PovAddict> netcat will send to that port what it receives from stdin

14:36 <yoyo[RKN]> but it should not read from stdin

14:36 <PovAddict> that's what netcat does

14:37 <PovAddict> if you don't want that, redirect /dev/null into stdin

14:37 <yoyo[RKN]> like this netcat < /dev/null ?

14:37 <PovAddict> netcat -ulp 9390 < /dev/null | epic -d -c \#rechenkraft yoyo_bot

14:38 <yoyo[RKN]> I'll try it

14:40 <yoyo[RKN]> now it does no more listen on port 9390

14:40 <PovAddict> you sure you don't have netcat already running and using that port number?

14:40 <PovAddict> like, the "stopped" process

14:41 <yoyo[RKN]> oh no, it listens

14:41 <yoyo[RKN]> and does not stop any more

14:43 <yoyo[RKN]> but it listens only once

14:46 <yoyo[RKN]> I just want to try the second topic here

14:46 <Romulus> Title: IRCD - Wikitech (at

14:48 <PovAddict> hrm

14:50 *** PovAddict has left #boinc

15:13 *** PovAddict has joined #boinc

15:21 * MTughan is hacking his iPod with Linux

15:29 <PovAddict> fun

15:33 <yoyo[RKN]> I got it running now

15:33 <yoyo[RKN]> used an own netcat

15:37 <MTughan> All right, that was fun... Booted the VM. Welcome to the RAM crunch.

15:37 <MTughan> Anyway...

15:37 <MTughan> &google Rockbox

15:37 <Romulus> MTughan: Search took 0.17 seconds: Rockbox - Open Source Jukebox Firmware: <>; Rockbox 3.0: <>; Rockbox - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia: <>; ROCKBOX THEATER - EXPERIENCE THE GOLDEN ERA OF ROCK N ROLL IN ...: <>; Rockbox - Free software downloads and reviews - CNET (2 more messages)

15:37 <MTughan> That's what I'm using.

15:38 <MTughan> Just reloading all my music.

15:38 <PovAddict> custom firmware?

15:38 <MTughan> Basically.

15:38 <PovAddict> I recall that name

15:38 <PovAddict> seemed quite awesome

15:38 <PovAddict> only way to get ogg vorbis on an iPod :(

15:38 <MTughan> Can play Vorbis and FLAC too.

15:39 * PovAddict hits Apple building with an ogg file

15:39 <MTughan> I installed some tools from Xiph to play OGG on QuickTime, then modded the Info.plist file to make QT the default player. Worked out rather well actually.

15:39 <MTughan> Still not as good as native support, but it works.

15:40 <MTughan> Most of my music right now is MP3, but I'm thinking about moving to Vorbis or FLAC.

15:40 <PovAddict> and that lets you play ogg on iTunes?

15:40 <MTughan> I would think so. I haven't tried it yet.

15:40 <PovAddict> my point was ogg on the iPod :)

15:41 *** siofwolves has quit IRC

15:41 <MTughan> Nope, it'd have to be converted to MP3 or AAC before going on a standard iPod.

15:41 <MTughan> While iTunes would do that, still doesn't quite do what we want.

15:42 <MTughan> Rockbox has a nice fade on the backlight...

15:46 <MTughan> Good, MP3 works.

15:48 <PovAddict> &url last --with compare

15:48 <Romulus> PovAddict:;991407.gif

15:48 <PovAddict> zomg

15:49 <MTughan> :D

15:51 <MTughan> PovAddict: You got your object files on AQUA.

15:51 <MTughan> And you noticed already...

15:51 <PovAddict> heh

15:52 <MTughan> The thing about in-ear headphones: earwax.

15:53 <yoyo[RKN]> btw who is the owner of Romulus

15:53 <MTughan> xcamel.

15:53 <PovAddict> yoyo[RKN]: xcamel

15:53 <PovAddict> MTughan: ew

15:53 <MTughan> I prefer the full headphones, but the connecter frayed on them... :(

15:53 <MTughan> At least these are noise-cancelling.

15:57 <xcamel_> re-hi

15:57 <MTughan> 'lo jay

15:57 *** xcamel_ is now known as xcamel

15:57 <MTughan> Damn shift key... Jay*

15:57 *** ChanServ sets mode: +o xcamel

15:57 *** xcamel sets mode: -o xcamel

15:58 <MTughan> For a second there, I thought you were going to kick me... :P

15:58 <PovAddict> +o is a cop hat

16:10 *** yoyo[RKN] has quit IRC

16:13 <xcamel> no, just a chanop

16:14 <xcamel> not in a kicking mood just now anyway...

16:15 <xcamel> bloody storm makes my head feel like its going to implode.

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16:38 <PovAddict> heh, a shell without "ls"

16:38 <PovAddict> "Some of the disabled options may seem rather arbitrary, but when you already have a choice of echo * and tar cvf /dev/null to list the current directory, ls really is a luxury."

16:43 <xcamel> when you have the option to do everything the hard way, why change....???

16:44 <PovAddict> xcamel: it's a shell designed to fit in extremely little space, and be *just* powerful enough to run shellscripts to get the rest of the real OS running

16:44 <PovAddict> definitely not for people to use

16:44 <xcamel> utilishell

16:44 <PovAddict> I have seen it in Linux distro install CDs, if you switch to a tty while it installs

16:45 <xcamel> just a little more then a bootstrap

16:45 <PovAddict> yup

16:45 <xcamel> or than, even

16:45 <PovAddict> I was reading an article on how to make a LiveCD

16:45 <xcamel> ah

16:46 <PovAddict> and indeed, BusyBox is only used while booting

16:46 <xcamel> damn.. right in the middle of the heavy freezing rain band...

16:47 <xcamel> this just ain't gonna be pretty by morning..

16:53 <PovAddict> :/

16:54 <CoderForLife> greetings boincaholics

16:54 *** wdsmia_w has quit IRC

16:54 <PovAddict> &grab CoderForLife

16:54 <Romulus> PovAddict: The operation succeeded.

16:54 <CoderForLife> what is grab?

16:55 <xcamel> not a valid plugin...

16:55 <PovAddict> &quotegrabs random CoderForLife

16:55 <Romulus> PovAddict: <CoderForLife> greetings boincaholics

16:55 <PovAddict> &quotegrabs random

16:55 <Romulus> PovAddict: <efc> You roll the trees down a bumpy hill and this creates a "log-o-rhythm"

16:56 <PovAddict> lol

16:56 <xcamel> ah.. quotegrab

16:56 <PovAddict> that was such a terrible pun

16:56 <CoderForLife> Security is Rarely Convenient (tm)

16:56 <xcamel> &quotegrabs random PovAddict

16:56 <Romulus> xcamel: <PovAddict> "There comes a time in every young geeks life where he resolves to locate the designer of the motherboard they've just been installing and string them up from the nearest tall object."

16:58 <xcamel> figures it would be something longwinded

16:58 <PovAddict> lol

17:01 <xcamel> so... do I wake up with 24" of snow, or 2" of ice?

17:02 <PovAddict> uh

17:02 <PovAddict> those the only options?

17:07 <xcamel> seems so..

17:07 <PovAddict> that's no fun

17:09 <xcamel> nope, not really..

17:12 <DerMeister> I would take the snow :P

17:14 <xcamel> that would be my choice too..

17:14 <xcamel> &wx 12074

17:14 <Romulus> xcamel: Temperature: 26.5F / -3.1C | Humidity: 94% | Pressure: 30.06in / 1017.8hPa (Falling) | Conditions: Light Freezing Rain | Wind Direction: East | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Tonight - Freezing rain...snow and sleet. Precipitation may be heavy at times. Snow and sleet accumulation of 1 to 3 inches. Ice accumulation around one half of an inch. The low in the mid 20s. North winds 5 to 10 (2 more messages)

17:15 <xcamel> &more

17:15 <Romulus> xcamel: Reply, RootWarner, Scheduler, Seen, Services, ShrinkUrl, Status, Stock, String, Success, Supybot, Tail, Time, URL, Unix, UrbanDict, User, Utilities, Weather, Web, WordStats, and Zipinfo

17:15 <xcamel> oops

17:15 <xcamel> &wx 12074

17:15 <Romulus> xcamel: Temperature: 26.5F / -3.1C | Humidity: 94% | Pressure: 30.06in / 1017.8hPa (Falling) | Conditions: Light Freezing Rain | Wind Direction: East | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Tonight - Freezing rain...snow and sleet. Precipitation may be heavy at times. Snow and sleet accumulation of 1 to 3 inches. Ice accumulation around one half of an inch. The low in the mid 20s. North winds 5 to 10 (2 more messages)

17:15 <xcamel> &more

17:15 <Romulus> xcamel: mph. Chance of precipitation near 100 percent.; Friday - Freezing rain and snow in the morning...then a chance of snow showers in the afternoon. Total snow accumulation of 1 to 3 inches. The high in the mid 30s. North winds around 10 mph...becoming northwest in the afternoon. Chance of precipitation near 100 percent.; Friday Night - Partly cloudy. Colder with the low around 11. Northwest (1 more message)

17:15 <xcamel> &more

17:15 <Romulus> xcamel: winds 10 to 15 mph.; Winter Storm Warning for Saratoga County in effect until 1:00 PM EST on December 12, 2008;

17:16 <xcamel> not pretty.

17:22 <CoderForLife> ugh

17:23 <CoderForLife> purdy sunset here - alternating hot pink and deep blue stripes parallel to the horizon

17:23 <PovAddict> &math 2**24

17:23 <Romulus> PovAddict: 16777216

17:28 <wdsmia> re-hi

17:29 <CoderForLife> lol  DerMeister  -  I picked the snow too, this morning when chatting with xcamel

17:29 <CoderForLife> ice is not nice

17:29 <CoderForLife> wb wdsmia

17:30 <wdsmia>

17:30 <Romulus> <> (at

17:31 <CoderForLife> heh

17:32 <xcamel> snow in NOLA

17:32 <xcamel> first time in like 35 years..

17:33 <CoderForLife> I was talking to a guy in LA today - said he had 3 inches

17:33 <CoderForLife> on the grass, none on the pavement

17:35 <xcamel> how do they train the snow to do that?

17:36 <CoderForLife> snow has an aversion to LA pavement

17:36 <xcamel> probably for many reasons we won't discuss here...

17:37 <CoderForLife> it's best that way

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17:44 <xcamel> 'lo zombie

17:45 <zombie67> hi

17:46 <xcamel> and re-poof TM

17:50 <Tank_Master> stupid router

17:52 <CoderForLife> but you repeat yourself

17:53 <CoderForLife> bbiab

18:07 *** yoyo[RKN] has quit IRC

18:15 <CoderForLife> well - the family vote was I am to wrap presents - ho ho ho

18:15 <CoderForLife> laterz

18:17 <MTughan> All right, something's wrong with my machine... Programs won't quit, and the CPU fan won't spin up. I'll be gone for a couple hours.

18:18 *** MTughan has quit IRC

18:26 <xcamel> bbl..

18:26 *** DerMeister has quit IRC

18:30 <Soul_keeper> i signed some servpro documents with gimp, will this suffice ?

18:54 <Soul_keeper> x and y coordinates, which one is horizontal ?

19:03 <Soul_keeper> ok nm

19:09 *** MTughan has joined #boinc

19:10 <MTughan> Advice for anyone: clean out your computers. My laptop is running a full 10C cooler after dusting out.

19:10 *** efc has joined #boinc

19:10 <Soul_keeper> :)

19:11 <efc> Moo

19:18 <PovAddict> my P4 really needs that

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19:30 * xcamel yawns

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19:46 <xcamel> "Major Democrat scandal and CNN and MSNBC major headlines are about the Zoo and Sharks."

19:47 <xcamel> (and how the economy is hurting the poor animals)

19:47 <PovAddict> maybe they think "democrat scandal" is no news?

19:47 <xcamel> they think "democrat scandal" is not possible in this universe.

19:48 <PovAddict> so they pretend it's not there?

19:49 <xcamel> they truly believe it is just not possible.

20:55 *** sethy has joined #boinc

20:55 <sethy> ohi?

20:57 <zombie67> what's with all the new projects using no redundancy lately?

20:57 <PovAddict> just start sending invalid results and they'll learn

20:58 <zombie67> but if they have a real way of screening for those...

20:58 <PovAddict> I think most that use no redundancy also have a dummy validator :P

20:58 <PovAddict> let's find out!

20:58 <zombie67> did you just see the milkyway news?

20:58 <PovAddict> no

20:59 <PovAddict> heh noobs

20:59 <zombie67> the point:  boinc was built assuming redundancy.  Perhaps that was a false base to build on.

20:59 <PovAddict> projects should *assume* science apps will send bad results at some point

20:59 <PovAddict> if they have to rely on correctness, they should run a local server farm with controlled temperatures

21:00 <zombie67> my point:  they may already assume that, and have stuff in place to deal with it.

21:00 <zombie67> why cut your processing power in 1/2 or 1/3, if it's not needed?

21:00 <xcamel> man... non stop ugly out there..

21:00 <PovAddict> there are other redundancy methods now

21:00 <PovAddict> like, give 1 result per WU

21:01 <PovAddict> if a user returns an invalid result, start using redundancy for any workunit crunched from that user, for a while

21:01 <zombie67> the point:  the default credit method assumes multiple results

21:01 <PovAddict> oh credits >.<

21:01 <zombie67> yes!

21:01 <PovAddict> let's not get into such big trouble, it's midnight

21:01 <zombie67> that is what I am getting at.

21:01 <PovAddict> I don't want to have nightmares

21:01 <zombie67> nonono

21:01 <PovAddict> don't mention credits >.<

21:01 <zombie67> I am not agruing one way or the other.

21:02 <zombie67> my point is that the default method seems to apply to less and less projects

21:02 <zombie67> perhaps there should be a different default

21:02 <PovAddict> like?

21:02 <Romulus> Somebody said like is saying Clemenceau about military "the war was something too serious to let it to military" ( it was a french general ) , i say about politics :), PovAddict

21:02 * PovAddict kicks Romulus

21:02 <PovAddict> ...ow my foot

21:03 <PovAddict> it's hard to make a better default

21:04 <zombie67> dunno.  I am just point out that the default method is running into this mess more and more frequently.  It's going to give BOINC a bad name, and disuade future projects

21:04 <PovAddict> it would be like giving a better default validator that can catch errors without redundancy

21:04 <zombie67> I am not saying i have the answer

21:05 <zombie67> I am pointing out the problem, and a trend

21:05 <PovAddict> I do

21:05 <zombie67> ok

21:05 <zombie67> go for it

21:05 <PovAddict> use WU counting by default (1 credit per WU no matter length) and throw cross-project parity out the window \o/

21:06 <zombie67> "throw cross-project parity out the window"....well yeah...many of us have been saying that it chasing a dream.  Just say it out loud!

21:08 <PovAddict> double compute_granted_credit(WORKUNIT& wu, vector<RESULT>& results) {

21:08 <PovAddict>     return 1;

21:08 <PovAddict> }

21:08 * PovAddict compiles and deploys

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21:16 <PovAddict> zombie67: go look at silly pi project

21:16 <PovAddict> I gave 1 credit per WU; I don't care about parity because I don't export credits :)

21:26 <sethy> installing debian

21:26 <sethy> :D

21:28 <xcamel> 'lo sethy

21:29 * MTughan is currently in the process of ticking off the RIAA.

21:32 <MTughan> Although I'm not really doing anything illegal...

21:34 <Soul_keeper> that would make them angry

21:34 * xcamel listens to the freezing rain build up..

21:34 <Soul_keeper> they are happy when you break the law, specially if you make it easy for them to track you

21:34 <Soul_keeper> that's how they get payed

21:34 <MTughan> I'm removing the DRM from some tracks to use in Rockbox.

21:34 <MTughan> I still bought them off the iTunes store.

21:38 <MTughan> Awesome, it works.

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21:50 <xcamel> laterz..

21:55 <zombie67> pov, did I mis work?

22:11 <PovAddict> you did

22:15 <zombie67> dang

22:16 <zombie67> apparently you are masquerading as me! Or visa versa

22:16 <PovAddict> huh? no

22:17 <zombie67> yeah

22:18 <MTughan> Gah... Anyone tried using Vorbis for audio files before? Ever gotten status at the end?

22:18 <PovAddict> wasnt that ChertseyAl mixing up our posts or smth?

22:18 <MTughan> static*

22:19 <zombie67> because have have early account numbers, her thought we were the same,

22:20 <zombie67> when I joined back in aug, there was no RSS, or anything like that.  Now that there is, I will watch more closely!

22:21 <zombie67> this affront of no credits shall not stand!!

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