IRC logs of #boinc for Wednesday, 2009-06-10

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00:26 <MTughan> 'lo Nick

00:27 <Nickuwo> hey MT

00:29 <Nickuwo> damn roomate knocked the modem... ethernet cable fell out

00:30 <PovAddict> how's ramsey doing?

00:30 <MTughan> PovAddict: Weren't you off to bed?

00:31 <PovAddict> i almost am

00:31 <Nickuwo> pretty well... almost found our first lower bound.

00:32 <PovAddict> a possible help for my ircoholism would be blocking my iPod touch from the WiFi network past midnight

00:33 <Nickuwo> do IRC Anon groups exist?

00:33 <PovAddict> yes, but they are online

00:33 <MTughan> On IRC?

00:34 <Nickuwo> haha

00:34 <PovAddict> do you think Alcoholics Anon meet at bars? that would make little sense

00:34 <MTughan> No, but the Simpsons say they have coffee.

00:34 <MTughan> So dropping them off alcohol for caffeine?

00:35 <MTughan> So instead of wasted, they get high.

00:38 <PovAddict> once drunk, what do they do?

00:38 <PovAddict> they drink some more

00:40 <PovAddict> I feel really tired

00:40 <PovAddict> and yet I continue... where's IRC Anon again?

00:41 <MTughan> /msg NickServ help ghost

00:41 <MTughan> :P

00:43 <MTughan> I suppose that's the strength of BitTorrent... Downloading Fedora 11. Fastest download I'm getting from a single user is 3.2KB/s. But overall is 140KB/s.

00:44 <MTughan> Ah, now I'm up to 1MB/s...

00:44 <MTughan> And uploading almost as fast already... o_O

00:44 <MTughan> I just started this.

00:44 <PovAddict> I have photo sharing/tagging plans involving BT

00:45 <MTughan> Now downloading and uploading both at 1MB/s.

00:46 <PovAddict> teenager goes to party, takes three hundred pictures and a few giant-in-filesize video; next day friends ask for them

00:46 <PovAddict> then what? he/she uploads them to facebook/flickr/something?

00:47 <MTughan> Yeah, BT would be useful there.

00:47 <MTughan> Gotta make it easier to make a torrent file though.

00:47 <PovAddict> he uploads them to flickr, which has big servers, paid by Yahoo

00:48 <PovAddict> flickr has a storage limit, that I believe can be upgraded with $$

00:49 <PovAddict> or to facebook which also has big servers paid by... investors, since FB doesnt have much of a profit source yet

00:50 <PovAddict> what's the chance of me making a picture tagging service and my bandwidth/disk surviving? (or my wallet, if I gt real hosting)

00:51 <PovAddict> users provide the storage and bandwidth; problem solved...? :)

00:54 <Nickuwo> bt seems to be a vast resource that as of yet (perhaps thanks to misinformation spread by riaa, mpaa, etc..) is completely underused...

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00:57 <Nickuwo> spose time warner charging $35 for 50KB/s upstream has something to do with that as well...

00:58 <PovAddict> I have 30KB/s up

00:58 <MTughan> All ISPs charge business prices for good upload speeds, even though it probably doesn't cost them any more to actually provide those speeds.

00:59 <MTughan> I'm lucky here. I have 10Mbps up and down.

00:59 <PovAddict> fastest my ISP has, afaik (3mbit down, 256kbit up)

00:59 <PovAddict> I want symmetric speeds <3

01:00 <Nickuwo> dont tell time warner that. they'll give ya 50KB/s down as well

01:00 <PovAddict> lol

01:01 <PovAddict> sleep ->

01:02 <Nickuwo> l8r pov

01:05 <XioNYC> A Time Warner-affiliate charges me the outrageous amount of $45/mo for 64KB/s up, 1024MB/s down, and a 50/50 connection.

01:07 <PovAddict> 8Mbit?

01:07 <XioNYC> "10Mbit"

01:07 <MTughan> Nice sleep.

01:08 <XioNYC> I'd kill for fiber op in Manhattan, though: 10MB/s down sustained, 1MB/s up sustained.  Note: Mega-Bytes.

01:09 <XioNYC> On on Long Island it's $30/mo.  In Manhattan, it's a pipe dream.

01:10 <PovAddict> MTughan: shush

01:10 <efc> Regulation?

01:11 <XioNYC> To me "regulation"?

01:11 <PovAddict> MTughan: you're jealous that I can IRC from within dreams and you cant

01:11 <Nickuwo> lucid IRCing?

01:12 <PovAddict> sort of

01:12 <efc> Like maybe the city forces a monopoly or something

01:12 <PovAddict> but seriously, I better go for real before I go blind :/

01:13 <XioNYC> Oh, 100% monopoly-zone.  Either you get crappy DSL from the phone co., or crappy cable from the cable co..  I'm seriously considering starting up a fiber op co.

01:13 <Nickuwo> you dont go blind from not sleeping, you go blind from masturbating too much

01:14 <Nickuwo> or at least that's what my catholic schoolteachers used to tell me

01:14 <PovAddict> Nickuwo: you do go blind from not sleeping, if you stare at a LCD screens most of the time you're awake...

01:15 <PovAddict> or more specifically, staring at a screen SO many hours a day cant be good for my eyes

01:16 <Nickuwo> thats because there is a linear relationship between the amount of time spent staring at an LCD screen and the amount of time spent masturbating :)

01:16 <PovAddict> maybe I dont blink often enough while looking at the screen, I heard thats common

01:16 <PovAddict> ...

01:16 <PovAddict> &grab nickuwo

01:16 <Romulus> PovAddict: The operation succeeded.

01:17 <Nickuwo> lol. i crack myself up

01:18 <PovAddict> that doesnt affect your eyes

01:19 <PovAddict> it affects other spherical-shaped pair of organs

01:19 <Nickuwo> hah

01:20 <PovAddict> or should I say, it doesnt affct your eyeballs, it affe-- <gets banned from the channel>

01:21 <Nickuwo> lol

01:21 <Nickuwo> all the admins are asleep methinks

01:21 <Nickuwo> mutiny!

01:26 <XioNYC> Hello!  My name is XioNYC, and I'll be the leader of tonight's coup d'etat...

01:26 <Nickuwo> I hope there'll be punch and pie...

01:26 <XioNYC> If there's any government position you are interested in, please don't hesitate to ask.  Operators are standing by to take your bribe...

01:27 <XioNYC> For your entertainment tonight, we'll start with a wonderful act: shooting the political opposition!

01:28 <XioNYC> (etc...)

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03:03 <wolf_pup> gn

03:03 <efc> night wolf

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06:29 <hawmps> 'lo

06:30 <hawmps> spork >>,

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06:34 <JamesB192> &whatis linux

06:34 <Romulus> JamesB192: Error: No factoid matches that key.

06:34 <JamesB192> &whatis gentoo

06:34 <Romulus> JamesB192: Error: No factoid matches that key.

06:38 <hawmps> hmm.. was working..

06:38 <hawmps> &linux

06:38 <Romulus> hawmps: Are you daft?

06:38 <hawmps> grrr..

06:39 <hawmps> &whatis windows

06:39 <Romulus> hawmps: "windows" could be

06:41 <hawmps> Romulus, linux is

06:41 <Romulus> hawmps: Are you daft?

06:43 <hawmps> &whatis linux

06:43 <Romulus> hawmps: Error: No factoid matches that key.

06:47 <hawmps> &whatis linux

06:47 <Romulus> hawmps: "linux" could be

06:48 <hawmps> all fixed

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09:06 <hawmps> spork >>

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09:23 <ELGono> &weather meiningen,germany

09:23 <Romulus> ELGono: Temperature: 57°F / 14°C | Humidity: 72% | Pressure: 30.01in / 1016hPa | Conditions: Light Rain Showers | Wind Direction: West | Wind Speed: 11mph / 18km/h | Updated: 3:00 PM CEST; Chance of Rain. High:62 F.; Chance of Rain. Low:53 F.; Chance of Rain. High:66 F.; Chance of Rain. Low:53 F.; Chance of Rain. High:55 F.; Chance of Rain. Low:48 F.;

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12:11 <MTughan> How do you think this computer would do on MW?

12:11 <Romulus> <> (at

12:11 <MTughan> :P

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12:46 <mweltin> morn'n MTughan

12:46 <MTughan> 'lo mw

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12:52 <mweltin> I grow ever increasingly tired of my job.

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13:01 <MTughan> I see what Pov means now by IRC being a development distraction...

13:02 <MTughan> Trying to write a BOINC viewer for iPhone, and I keep getting distracted by that flashing XChat icon in the taskbar.

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13:02 <RomW> lol

13:02 <RomW> Any form of IM is a development distraction

13:03 <RomW> People are generally event driven.

13:03 <mweltin> yes and IM is really just email with the instant gratification level set to high.

13:03 <MTughan> mweltin didn't see my messages...

13:03 <MTughan> <MTughan> I see what Pov means now by IRC being a development distraction...

13:03 <MTughan> <MTughan> Trying to write a BOINC viewer for iPhone, and I keep getting distracted by that flashing XChat icon in the taskbar.

13:04 <mweltin> I missed that

13:04 <MTughan> Yeah, you quit just before I sent them.

13:04 <mweltin> I working on a Flex app and it's all of a sudden has a crazy bug

13:05 <mweltin> took the windows approach and killed my  X session in hopes that that would help.

13:05 * mweltin fingers goes.

13:07 <mweltin> calling a window manager/server and advancement is like calling a "hot pocket" a pizza.

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13:18 <Nickuwo> mmm... hot pockets

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13:30 <PovAddict> &grab RomW

13:30 <Romulus> PovAddict: The operation succeeded.

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14:07 <hawmps> &quote random

14:07 <Romulus> hawmps: Error: I have no quotes in my database for #boinc.

14:08 <MTughan> &quotegrabs random

14:08 <Romulus> MTughan: <efc> That was the pun equivilent of Hiroshima

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15:51 <wolf_pup> moo

16:03 <xcamel> 'lo

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18:07 <Romulus> New news from boinc: BOINC news June 10, 2009

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18:10 <wolf_pup> hmm

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18:24 <CoderForLife> &wx 45140

18:24 <Romulus> CoderForLife: Temperature: 70.7F / 21.5C | Humidity: 93% | Pressure: 29.55in / 1000.6hPa (Steady) | Conditions: Mostly Cloudy | Wind Direction: WNW | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Tonight - Mostly cloudy. A chance of showers and thunderstorms this evening... then showers and thunderstorms likely after midnight. Some thunderstorms may produce heavy rainfall. Lows in the lower 60s. South winds (2 more messages)

18:25 <CoderForLife> &more

18:25 <Romulus> CoderForLife: around 5 mph. Chance of rain 70 percent.; Thursday - Showers and thunderstorms. Some thunderstorms may produce heavy rainfall. Highs in the upper 70s. Southwest winds around 5 mph. Chance of rain 80 percent.; Thursday Night - Mostly cloudy. Showers and thunderstorms likely...mainly in the evening. Lows in the lower 60s. Southwest winds around 5 mph...becoming light northeast winds (1 more message)

18:25 <CoderForLife> &more

18:25 <Romulus> CoderForLife: after midnight. Chance of rain 70 percent.; Areal Flood Watch for Hamilton County in effect until 8:00 PM EDT on June 11, 2009;

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18:42 <xcamel> 'lo

18:44 <CoderForLife> hey

18:46 <CoderForLife> brb

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18:49 <CoderForLife> b

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18:49 <xcamel> wb

18:49 <xcamel> 'lo zombie

18:50 <CoderForLife> thx

18:51 <CoderForLife> slow moving rainmaker heading this way

18:52 <CoderForLife> going to sleep some now, to get it in before the after-midnight arrival of the front

18:52 <CoderForLife> so... gn

18:52 <xcamel> thought it already went by...

18:52 <CoderForLife> see above

18:53 <CoderForLife> gn

18:54 <zombie67> hi x

18:54 <xcamel> &nn

18:54 <Romulus> Live long and crunch!

19:06 <xcamel> &wx 12074

19:06 <Romulus> xcamel: Temperature: 71.7F / 22.1C | Humidity: 64% | Pressure: 29.89in / 1012.1hPa (Falling) | Conditions: Overcast | Wind Direction: SW | Wind Speed: 1.0mph / 1.6km/h ; Tonight - Partly cloudy with a slight chance of showers this evening...then mostly cloudy with a chance of showers after midnight. Lows in the upper 50s. West winds around 5 mph this evening...becoming light and variable. Chance (1 more message)

19:06 <xcamel> &more

19:06 <Romulus> xcamel: of rain 30 percent.; Thursday - Mostly cloudy. A chance of showers in the morning...then showers likely with a chance of thunderstorms in the afternoon. Highs in the mid 70s. Southeast winds around 5 mph. Chance of rain 60 percent.; Thursday Night - Showers likely with a chance of thunderstorms. Lows in the lower 60s. Southeast winds 5 to 10 mph. Chance of rain 70 percent.;

19:09 <PovAddict> anyone with a non-Debian Linux distro, can you check if you have /usr/share/xml/iso-codes/ ?

19:09 <xcamel> just a sec..

19:11 <xcamel> yes.

19:12 <xcamel> you need it?

19:13 <xcamel> I have both /usr/share/iso-codes && /usr/share/xml/iso-codes

19:13 <PovAddict> nope, I just wanted to know if it was a Debian thing, or it was more widespread on other distros

19:13 <PovAddict> thx

19:17 <xcamel> np

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19:32 <PovAddict> great, my computer just corrupted a SD memory

19:32 <PovAddict> seems to have flushed the disk cache from a SD memory while umounting *another*

19:33 <xcamel> ouch

19:33 <PovAddict> fank thuck I already sent somebody else the pictures that were here

19:33 <PovAddict> I tried putting the b0rked memory in my digital camera

19:33 <PovAddict> and the camera seems to *hang*

19:34 <xcamel> epic fail?

19:34 <PovAddict> well I doubt the memory is physically corrupted

19:34 <PovAddict> probably a reformat would make it work again

19:34 <PovAddict> but bye data

19:37 <xcamel> there are a bunch of sd recovery utilities out there..

19:37 <PovAddict> I think the problem is I once removed a SD memory without umounting first

19:37 <PovAddict> and my machine didn't even notice

19:37 <PovAddict> so the problem was

19:37 <PovAddict> plug memory 1 in

19:37 <PovAddict> mount it

19:37 <PovAddict> remove memory 1, plug memory 2

19:37 <PovAddict> umount

19:37 <PovAddict> disk buffers with data from memory 1 are flushed to memory 2

19:38 <PovAddict> *boom*

19:39 * PovAddict wonders if fsck.vfat would work

19:39 <PovAddict> I guess i better make a copy of the current (bad) data

19:41 <PovAddict> the OS is so confused... it thinks the memory is smaller than it actually is

19:41 <xcamel> dd it

19:41 <PovAddict> yes, I dd'd the (only) partition, and it only copied 504MB

19:41 <PovAddict> this is a 2GB memory

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19:41 <PovAddict> now trying to copy the disk device itself (/dev/sde, not /dev/sde1)

19:42 <PovAddict> nope, copied 504MB anyway o_O

19:43 <PovAddict> it's strange, dmesg identified it correctly

19:43 <PovAddict> sd 6:0:0:2: [sde] 3970048 512-byte hardware sectors (2033 MB)

19:43 <xcamel> hmmm.

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19:44 <PovAddict> unplugged, re-plugged, trying again

19:45 <PovAddict> syslog still shows correct size

19:45 <PovAddict> dd in progress

19:46 <xcamel> dd may ignore the blown fat

19:47 <PovAddict> dd ignores the filesystem completely

19:47 <PovAddict> and I'm even ignoring the partition table, copying the whole "disk", not the partition

19:48 <PovAddict> but it still copies the size of the other card

19:48 * PovAddict considers blaming this cheap-ass memory card reader -.-

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19:50 <PovAddict> &google calc 985025 * 512 bytes

19:50 <Romulus> PovAddict: Google's calculator didn't come up with anything.

19:51 <PovAddict> &math calc 985025 * 512

19:51 <Romulus> PovAddict: 504332800

19:51 <efc> moo

19:51 <PovAddict> &math convert [math calc 985025 * 512] bytes to MiB

19:51 <Romulus> PovAddict: 480.969238281

19:51 <PovAddict> hwinfo says volume.num_blocks = 985025

19:51 <PovAddict> definitely wrong

19:52 <PovAddict> I can't easily reload the driver

19:52 <PovAddict> hwinfo says the memory card reader is using the 'sd' driver

19:53 <PovAddict> my hard disks are too, so... no

19:55 <PovAddict> something's stuck

19:55 <PovAddict> hwinfo reports 985025 blocks... even with nothing plugged in

20:10 <PovAddict> I think I'll have to reboot... I don't know of any other way to restart the card reader alone

20:11 <PovAddict> bye 19-day uptime

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20:58 * MTughan is fed, and now has his machine's temperature under control

20:58 <MTughan> Mac was overheating, as the fan was starting to get clogged with dust. That's fixed.

20:59 <MTughan> Desktop was also running hot, but a bit more ventilation has fixed that.

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22:29 <jasong>

22:29 <Romulus> Title: pastebin - collaborative debugging tool (at

22:29 <jasong> Does that look correct?

22:29 <jasong> I don

22:30 <jasong> t think xion would intentionally screw me, but I want a second opinion :)

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23:30 <jasong> since no one seems to be willing or able to answer that particular question and I need to get bed about 4 hours earlier than normal, I'm going to try to relax by asking a new question :)

23:31 <jasong> Accepting the fact that Moore's Law isn't truly a law and basically changes in definition depending on what tech is being discussed, does anyone think the advancement in technology will slow down in any major way in the next 5, 10 or 20 years?

23:32 <jasong> I mean clock speed has obviously hit a brick wall, so a lot of people haven't seen visible progress since about 2005 or so, so in a sense it's already hit a wall

23:33 <jasong> &monologue

23:33 <Romulus> jasong: Your current monologue is at least 8 lines long.

23:36 <infinisoft> Traditional Silicon process seems like it'll hit a wall in about 10 years.

23:37 <infinisoft> So it won't be possible to just throw more cores onto the die if i cann't get any smaller, unless new process tech comes along

23:38 <PovAddict> remember Intel already has a working prototype of an 80-core

23:39 <jasong> 80 cores at how many MHz?

23:39 <jasong> :evilgrin:

23:39 <infinisoft> Thats also not x86

23:39 <jasong> damn

23:40 <jasong> But can it play Crysis at a decent frame rate? ;)

23:40 <jasong> (old joke, I know)

23:40 <PovAddict> also

23:40 <PovAddict> will it blend?

23:40 <infinisoft> Seems like people think we'll eventually get a few big cores and lots of smallers like a Larrabee integrated on processor die

23:42 <jasong> BOINC is really going to start looking messy with all the work it will be downloading, we'll need a way to consolidate stuff at some point

23:42 <PovAddict> SETI could do an "enhanced again" app

23:42 <PovAddict> to make it slower :)

23:42 <jasong> lol

23:43 <jasong> Yeah, that 3d stuff used up about 30% cpu last time I checked

23:43 <jasong> I haven't run SETI in forever

23:43 <infinisoft> Larrabee is supposed to enable real time tracing according to the marketing papers :p

23:44 <jasong> btw, where does the word Larrabee come from?

23:44 <PovAddict> infinisoft: yeah, and there's forward raytracers appearing

23:44 <PovAddict> so that we can revive the days of taking hours to render a sphere on a plane, just like decades ago :)

23:44 <jasong> forward ray tracers?

23:45 <infinisoft> page 12

23:45 <jasong> thanks

23:45 <PovAddict> jasong: normal ("backwards") raytracers trace rays from the camera onto objects, then measure the angle between the object and the light sources, and figure out what lighting to give it

23:46 <PovAddict> forwards raytracers are more physically correct, tracing light from the light sources onto objects, which is how the Real World works

23:46 <PovAddict> but it's some orders of magnitude slower

23:46 <jasong> lol, add more power and programmers will find a way to use it

23:47 <jasong> or return things to a standstill

23:47 <infinisoft> jasong:

23:47 <infinisoft> I asked him where the name Larrabee came from.

23:47 <infinisoft> He said Larrabee was from the TV show Get Smart. The chiefs assistant, Larrabee, didnt get much respect. The Larrabee project has been in the works at Intel for a while and didnt get much respect initially.

23:47 <PovAddict> yeah well

23:47 <PovAddict> at least in this case, you get more quality for the extra CPU time

23:47 <PovAddict> and it's all heavy computation

23:48 <PovAddict> the problem is with things like office suites, that take longer to *start up*

23:48 <jasong> I wonder how Folding@home would use the 80 processors

23:49 <jasong> It just seems like a waste to just have 80 cpus doing their own thing

23:49 <jasong> lol, but think about and 80 processors

23:50 <jasong> +u

23:51 <infinisoft> I just found some uarch details on that terascale project:

23:51 <Romulus> <> (at

23:51 <infinisoft> 80 cores running at 4 GHz, each containing 2 floating point  multiply-accumulate units

23:53 <jasong> Yeah, but it says 2 and 3kb if I'm reading it right

23:54 <jasong> Even would have trouble fitting into that

23:55 <jasong> ahh, looks like their just experimenting to see what they can do.  this is from 2007

23:55 <jasong> oops their should be they're

23:55 <jasong> jason the dyslexic monkey boy

23:56 <infinisoft> That looks like the cache, so it might not have to fit in that, but thats just one of the possible issues.  Its more of a proof of concept vehicle more than a realistic chip IMO.

23:56 <PovAddict> &grab jasong

23:56 <Romulus> PovAddict: The operation succeeded.

23:57 <infinisoft> Its seems like one of those things where you might see horrible performance, just like what you easily get on GPUs

23:57 <jasong> I gotta get to bed, see you guys tomorrow I guess

23:57 <jasong> Yeah, but Schwarzenegger is a horrible performer too, and he's worth millions ;)

23:59 <infinisoft> heh :p

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