IRC logs of #boinc for Saturday, 2009-09-05

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06:52 <quail> <= wrecked

07:09 <kathryn__> gonna update my os

07:09 <kathryn__> laters

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07:50 <KathrynM> or not

07:50 <KathrynM> it'll have to wait until I can do some research on this change to ext4

07:50 <KathrynM> :/

07:50 <KathrynM> I think I'm going to have to back everything up and wipe out the whole partition table

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12:04 <desti> http://www.onlive.com/beta_program.html

12:04 <Romulus> Title: OnLive: Beta Program (at www.onlive.com)

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12:26 <wdsmia> &wx 50319

12:27 <Romulus> wdsmia: Temperature: 72.0F / 22.2C | Humidity: 73% | Pressure: 30.21in / 1022.9hPa (Rising) | Conditions: Partly Cloudy | Wind Direction: North | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Today - Sunny. Patchy fog through mid morning. High in the upper 70s. East wind 5 to 10 mph.; Tonight - Mostly clear. Patchy fog early in the morning. Low in the mid 50s. East wind near 10 mph.; Sunday - Mostly sunny. (1 more message)

12:27 <wdsmia> &more

12:27 <Romulus> wdsmia: Patchy fog through mid morning. High in the upper 70s. Southeast wind near 10 mph.;

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13:37 <desti> http://www.ustream.tv/channel/pirate-party-uk---live

13:37 <Romulus> <http://tinyurl.com/mbuf3m> (at www.ustream.tv)

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13:42 <ergZay> so how long until boinc supports GPU calculation on mac os x

13:42 <ergZay> seeing as snow leopard is out

13:42 <ergZay> with open cl

13:45 <Tank_Master> seeing as how sl just came out, and the low number of people who use it, it may take a bit

13:46 <Tank_Master> getting ATI support on windows and unix is what they are currently working on I believe, though there are new mac builds wich may also be including these changes

13:46 <Tank_Master> what version of BOI are you running?

13:46 <Tank_Master> BOINC*

13:47 <Tank_Master> http://boinc.berkeley.edu/dl/?C=M;O=D <- you can see the latest version here

13:47 <Romulus> Title: Index of /dl (at boinc.berkeley.edu)

13:48 <Tank_Master> oh, and BOIN dose not use openCL at all for any platform

13:48 <Tank_Master> BOINC*

13:49 <Tank_Master> just CUDA and CAL

13:49 * wdsmia slaps Tank_Master with a C key

13:50 * Tank_Master throws a keyboard at wdsmia

13:50 * wdsmia ducks

13:50 <Tank_Master> where?

13:57 <PovAddict> Tank_Master: why would it use opencl?

13:58 <Tank_Master> ?

13:58 <Tank_Master> I said it doesnt

13:58 <Tank_Master> ergZay was pointing out that snowleopard supports OCL

13:59 <PovAddict> what would be the point in using it?

13:59 <Tank_Master> would work on both ATI and nvidia?

13:59 <Tank_Master> I dunno

13:59 <PovAddict> all BOINC needs to do is detect that a GPU exists

13:59 <PovAddict> project science apps can ALREADY use OpenCL if they want to

13:59 <Tank_Master> why do you think I want it?

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14:25 <PovAddict> KathrynM: why do you want to go ext4?

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15:36 <jasong> Okay, totally ignorant question, assume I know almost nothing about the subject.  ATI is about to release a card with 1600 shaders, the GDDR5 is supposed to be 1.25Ghz, 2.5Ghz, and 5Ghz, but I'm not sure what's going into the card with 1600 shaders.  How much do shaders affect computing ability for science apps?

15:36 <Tank_Master> depends on the app, but generally the more the better

15:37 <Tank_Master> 1600 shaders is 2x the 48xx series

15:37 <Tank_Master> you can think of shaders and processing threads

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15:37 <jasong> But, in terms of work done, graphics cards tend to be cheaper for the projects that bother to make GPU apps, right?

15:38 <Tank_Master> for the output, tones

15:38 <Tank_Master> a 4850 wich you can get for about $100, can get about 60k RAC on milkyway

15:39 <jasong> What about Folding@Home?  How does that compare to a Core2Duo?

15:39 <Tank_Master> the 5850(or whatever the slower one is) should be about 100k a day id say

15:39 <Tank_Master> folding is a project

15:39 <Tank_Master> core2duo is a cou

15:40 <Tank_Master> cpu*

15:40 <jasong> Sorry, phrased the question badly, I meant how does a C2D compare to that card you mentioned in Folding@Home

15:41 <jasong> brb, drink

15:41 <Tank_Master> theres no compairison

15:41 <Tank_Master> the GPU wins hands down

15:42 <Tank_Master> GPUs may run at a slower clock speed, but they can run several hundered computations at once

15:45 <jasong> Last question, is there a site that touches on the problems BOINC has working with Linux?  I can't even get BOINC to recognize the home directory

15:46 <jasong> I wish people would quit funding BOINC, is going to be garbage as long as Berkeley has control

15:47 <Tank_Master> that I dont know

15:47 <yomshleeshee> if it's open source, can't you just make your own version?

15:47 <Tank_Master> yes

15:47 <Tank_Master> but that doesnt mean itll be supported

15:47 <yomshleeshee> i mean isn't that like saying linux will be garbage as long as Ubuntu is in "control"?

15:47 <Tank_Master> http://boinc.ssl.berkeley.edu/dev/forum_thread.php?id=2518 <- changelog for 6.x boinc

15:47 <Romulus> <http://tinyurl.com/l2zvs3> (at boinc.ssl.berkeley.edu)

15:48 <yomshleeshee> right I've just heard people say that, especially when they renewed their NSF grant, but I don't understand how they can have such a tough hold on it as people complain, as you just did

15:48 <yomshleeshee> I mean if I thought it sucked that bad, I'd just keep my source and ignore berkeley.edu and branch off

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15:50 <yomshleeshee> i don't know. I mean I know I had troubles and growing pains when I started my project, I don't think it was due to berkeley/Anderson being in charge. but maybe my perspective's different

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15:52 <PovAddict> <yomshleeshee> if it's open source, can't you just make your own version?

15:52 <PovAddict> we already did

15:53 <yomshleeshee> ok, so then what's the complaing about berkeley about then?

15:53 <Tank_Master> some of it got ported back into the main BOINC build to

15:53 <PovAddict> some of what?

15:53 <Tank_Master> crunch3r's code

15:53 <Tank_Master> for ATI support

15:54 <PovAddict> he made it specifically for that purpose

15:54 <PovAddict> giving it to BOINC

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16:59 <jasong> Yahoo Finance is crap

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17:12 <Tank_Master> anything yahoo is :P

17:35 <jasong> One of the most popular searches on Yahoo is cupachabra, or however you spell it

17:36 <jasong> What would you recommend for aggregating RSS feeds?

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18:43 <jasong> Where do I put my real name so that the Freenode server will list it when someone sends an information request?

18:45 <PovAddict> pidgin? I don't know if it lets you set that

18:46 <jasong> Ahhh, just the man I was looking for, I was told I should talk to you about Linux synecdoche

18:46 <jasong> Do you think it's ready for primetime?  Or at least more ready than regular BOINC?

18:47 <jasong> h,mmm, switching to the other channel

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18:57 <desti> http://www.flickr.com/photos/nasadesertrats/

18:57 <Romulus> Title: Flickr: NASA Desert RATS' Photostream (at www.flickr.com)

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19:14 <jasong> My boinc client says no cuda devices found.  I have no knowledge of what kind of graphics card I have, but assuming I want to crunch on it, what's the next step?  Is the fact that it says no CUDA devices mean I should just immediately give up?

19:14 <jasong> err, does the fact...

19:15 <PovAddict> first step is figuring out what kind of graphics card you have

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19:15 <jasong> brb

19:25 <PovAddict> jasong: don't you know the brand at least?

19:25 <PovAddict> nvidia or ati?

19:26 <jasong> not sure, it's been a while, just a sec I'll ask my father if he knows

19:26 <desti> lspci

19:26 <PovAddict> what OS?

19:26 <Romulus> hmm... what OS is it, PovAddict

19:26 <PovAddict> Romulus: die in a fire

19:26 <Romulus> PovAddict: No idea!

19:26 <PovAddict> also

19:26 <PovAddict> forget what OS

19:26 <Romulus> 10-4.

19:27 <jasong> It's Fedora 11

19:27 <PovAddict> lspci

19:27 <jasong> oh, sorry

19:29 <PovAddict> running lspci here tells me "01:00.0 VGA compatible controller: nVidia Corporation GeForce 8600 GT (rev a1)"

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19:52 <KathrynM> ouchy.

19:52 <KathrynM> jasong, I'm still working on it.

19:53 <KathrynM> how did you install BOINC

19:57 <Tank_Master> o0

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19:58 <zombie67> nqueens has an odd credit method.

19:58 <zombie67> quorum of 2

19:58 <zombie67> lesser claim x2 is the award

19:59 <PovAddict> credits are absolutely broken by now

19:59 <zombie67> have you ever seen the multiplier used against the lesser of the two claims?

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20:06 <jasong> You know how when you call tech support, one of the things they ask you is if the computer is plugged in?

20:06 * jasong hangs head in shame

20:07 <jasong> my laptop has been out of commission for about two weeks

20:07 <jasong> Guess why?

20:07 <PovAddict> empty battery

20:07 <jasong> The plug in the wall is in a very hard to see place

20:07 <jasong> and, yes, I feel like a moron

20:07 <PovAddict> &grab jasong

20:07 <Romulus> PovAddict: The operation succeeded.

20:08 <quail> 'morning all

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20:20 <quail> &wx ypad

20:20 <Romulus> quail: Temperature: 61°F / 16°C | Humidity: 42% | Pressure: 29.65in / 1004hPa | Conditions: Clear | Wind Direction: NNE | Wind Speed: 15mph / 24km/h | Updated: 9:30 AM CST; Unknown. High:53 F.; Chance of Rain. Low:51 F.; Chance of Rain. High:64 F.; Chance of Rain. Low:53 F.; Chance of Rain. High:64 F.; Clear. Low:48 F.;

20:21 <yomshleeshee> hey

20:21 <yomshleeshee> where's ypad?

20:22 <PovAddict> &zipinfo ypad

20:22 <Romulus> PovAddict: Error: Zip code must be a 5-digit integer.

20:22 <PovAddict> &airport ypad

20:22 <Romulus> PovAddict: Error: I couldn't find ypad in airport.

20:22 <quail> yomshleeshee: Adelaide Airport

20:22 <yomshleeshee> oh, ok

20:38 <zombie67> MT:  any word on CUDA drivers for OSX?

20:38 <zombie67> I have a couple of macs with CUDA GPUs

20:40 <Tank_Master> oh, zombie67, are you using 6.10.3 on those SL macs?

20:40 <zombie67> speak of the devil, a second project just moved to 2x lesser of claimed.  http://abcathome.com/forum_thread.php?id=453#10424

20:40 <Romulus> <http://tinyurl.com/lqqtfz> (at abcathome.com)

20:41 <PovAddict> I smell credit inflation

20:41 <Tank_Master> theres apparently some compatibility iddues fixed in that build for OSx 10.6

20:41 <zombie67> TM, I hav't upgraded to SL yet.

20:41 <zombie67> why?

20:41 <PovAddict> let's bomb some servers

20:41 <Tank_Master> ahh, I thought you had, my bad :P

20:41 <zombie67> pov, that change at ABC was to just bring them back to where they used to be

20:41 <zombie67> no inflation

20:41 <PovAddict> why did they go down?

20:42 <PovAddict> wasn't "where they used to be" too high?

20:42 <zombie67> they introduced a new app

20:42 <Tank_Master> different app

20:42 <PovAddict> maybe the old app was giving too much

20:42 <PovAddict> how does one know?

20:42 <zombie67> with the old ABC app, they had a curved scale before

20:42 <Tank_Master> PovAddict - for 32bit, no, but for 64bit, it was 2x the 32bit cus your doing 2x the work...

20:42 <PovAddict> ah yes, that curve that made no sense at all

20:42 <Tank_Master> that to

20:43 <Tank_Master> they used the curve to help prevent people from aborting the long WUs

20:43 <zombie67> but even without the curve, the 64 bit was 2x faster

20:43 <PovAddict> they CAN'T do that because of cross-project parity

20:43 <PovAddict> what if I choose to give 2x to keep people from aborting one thing or another...

20:43 <PovAddict> I'd give 2x more than other projects

20:44 <zombie67> it is not 2x credits, it is 2x faster

20:44 <PovAddict> zombie67: I'm talking about the curve

20:44 <Tank_Master> the 64bit did the WU in 1/2 the time

20:44 <Tank_Master> and got the same credit

20:45 <PovAddict> zombie67: if a 2x longer WU gave 3x credits "to keep people from aborting them", then those long WUs are giving 1.5x more credits than other projects

20:45 <zombie67> pov, the curve makes as much sense as some of the other nonsense

20:45 <PovAddict> the only solution is dropping cross-project parity officially, then project credits aren't competing against anyone but themselves, and there is no harm if they do that...

20:45 <PovAddict> projects can choose to pay more for what they need more without having to worry about the other projects

20:46 <zombie67> pov, you are preaching to the choir.  You know that.

20:47 <zombie67> in any case, ABC has been using the method for a couple years now.

20:47 <Tank_Master> I just run wich ever project offer good credit

20:47 <PovAddict> ^ I rest my case

20:47 <Tank_Master> rt now that AQUA on the CPU and collatz on my CUDA

20:48 <PovAddict> I can't believe some still say that people don't move between projects following the high credits

20:48 <zombie67> i work for mega milestones, which forces me to crunch crap projects.

20:48 <Tank_Master> and I dont, so I dont have that issue anymore :D

20:49 <Tank_Master> but yeah, it depends on the goal of the person crunching

20:49 <Tank_Master> not DA or the project admin

20:52 <zombie67> it turns out that 2xlowerclaim is usually about my machine's claim

20:52 <zombie67> sometimes a bit more, sometimes a bit less.

20:57 <jasong> Can't a project simply say,"Mr. Anderson is an ass, I don't give a flying f*** about cross-project parity."

21:00 <zombie67> sure

21:06 <zombie67> gerasim is gone?

21:08 <zombie67> finally broke 1M in malaria control, and 500k in virtual prarie

21:15 <zombie67> is MW issuing work for ATI, like CUDA works, with 6.10?

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21:35 <zombie67> Anansi is back up....

21:35 <zombie67> is it secure now?

21:35 <zombie67> pov/

21:35 <zombie67> ?

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21:45 <zombie67> they have a new key, which is requiring me to detach/reattach

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22:08 <zombie67> looks like mindmodeling will be eventually back after all

22:08 <zombie67> going to be buying a new server

22:22 <PovAddict> jasong: they can say "I don't give a flying f*** about cross-project parity." but they need to make that VERY clear

22:22 <PovAddict> and make really sure that, for example, stats sites don't add their credits to any "total"

22:23 <PovAddict> and make sure users know the credits aren't even meant to be comparable

22:25 <zombie67> no, no need to make the stats do (or not do) anything.

22:25 <PovAddict> yes you do

22:25 <PovAddict> if stats sites add project A and project B and say "this is your total", then they are assuming A and B credits are comparable

22:25 <zombie67> it is up to the stat sites if they chose to carry a project stats, or not

22:25 <PovAddict> if they are not, you can't add them

22:26 <zombie67> again, that is up to the stat sites

22:26 <zombie67> it is not up to a project, to demand how stats sites carry them or not

22:27 * PovAddict wants a real project to use his ideas on

22:27 <zombie67> take over RS

22:27 <zombie67> stat sites and projects are completely independent

22:27 <PovAddict> also

22:27 <PovAddict> we just got our asses kicked

22:28 <zombie67> oh?

22:28 <zombie67> in what way?

22:28 <Romulus> Somebody said in what way is that WAY better than what I already have, zombie67

22:28 <PovAddict> Brazil 3 - 1 Argentina

22:28 <zombie67> ah

22:28 <zombie67> football?

22:28 <PovAddict> yep

22:28 <zombie67> I am watching college football, the beter kind

22:29 <PovAddict> http://www.danielsands.co.cc/wp-content/upLoads/2009/01/handegg.jpg

22:29 <Romulus> <http://tinyurl.com/mglo5j> (at www.danielsands.co.cc)

22:34 <zombie67> forget in what way?

22:34 <Romulus> Gotcha!

22:46 <zombie67> my list of computers on anansi, shows a machine that is not mine

22:48 <PovAddict> o_o

22:48 <PovAddict> link?

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22:57 <KathrynM> stupid cats

22:57 <KathrynM> came home to my apartment floor covered in food.

22:57 <PovAddict> pulled cable?

22:57 <PovAddict> lol

22:57 <KathrynM> Ivory got up on the counter and pulled down the bag.

22:57 <KathrynM> both then proceeded to chew through the plastic to get it opne

22:58 <KathrynM> and X crashed or something

22:58 <PovAddict> I'd say smart cats then

22:58 <KathrynM> naughty cats

22:58 <PovAddict> "Beware of the cat"

22:59 <KathrynM> and when two of them get together.......  eek

23:00 <KathrynM> as to why ext4.  I think F11 requires it now

23:00 <KathrynM> I got into a loop where it would put / on an ext3 partition so when I tried to format it as ext4 then it told me it couldn't boot off an ext4 partition

23:00 <KathrynM> I tried to make a boot partiton but I have having issues resizing and I gave up

23:01 <KathrynM> I'm going to try the upgrade with the DVD rather than the clean install with the LiveCD like I used to do

23:01 <PovAddict> heh, that was needed back when you couldn't boot from ext3

23:01 <PovAddict> /boot in ext2

23:01 <PovAddict> looks like we've come full circle?

23:01 <KathrynM> dunno

23:01 <KathrynM> I got to frustrated and said screw it

23:02 <KathrynM> too even

23:02 <PovAddict> "Beware of the English teacher"?

23:02 <PovAddict> *ducks*

23:02 <KathrynM> yup

23:02 <KathrynM> :D

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23:03 <PovAddict> http://qdb.us/71947

23:03 <Romulus> Title: QDB: Quote #71947 (at qdb.us)

23:04 <KathrynM> lol

23:04 <KathrynM> my brother's cat chews power cords

23:16 <PovAddict> I'm suffering the Tetris Effect

23:17 <PovAddict> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tetris_effect

23:17 <Romulus> Title: Tetris effect - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at en.wikipedia.org)

23:29 <zombie67> http://canis.csc.ncsu.edu:8005/anansi/hosts_user.php?userid=24&show_all=1&sort=rpc_time

23:29 <Romulus> <http://tinyurl.com/l4eomz> (at canis.csc.ncsu.edu:8005)

23:29 <PovAddict> which isn't yours?

23:30 <PovAddict> also, did he mark the project non-cpu-intensive?

23:30 <zombie67> no, he didn't fix that yet

23:30 <PovAddict> "Copyright © 2009 REPLACE WITH COPYRIGHT HOLDER"

23:30 <zombie67> #21 is the not=mine

23:31 <zombie67> remember how I told you I was the team founder for an AMD team, and that is an AMD machine

23:31 <PovAddict> well, isn't it one that you *used* to have back in Nov 2008?

23:32 <zombie67> never

23:32 <zombie67> I don't have a AMD Phenom(tm) 9750 Quad-Core Processor

23:33 <zombie67> the name is dn07

23:33 <zombie67> not any of my machines

23:34 <zombie67> I am still the founder for AMD Users

23:34 <Tank_Master> I have a c2q 9750

23:34 <PovAddict> Tank_Master: what were you doing on his account?

23:34 <PovAddict> :P

23:34 <Tank_Master> lol

23:34 <Tank_Master> who's?

23:34 <Tank_Master> what?

23:35 <Tank_Master> not mine, I dont use crappy linux

23:35 <Tank_Master> and I dont use AMD either

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