IRC logs of #boinc for Thursday, 2010-07-15

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04:02 <CoderForLife> brb  Miranduh version upgrade

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05:24 <CoderForLife> &wx 45140

05:24 <Romulus> CoderForLife: Temperature: 68.9F / 20.5C | Humidity: 96% | Pressure: 30.01in / 1016.1hPa (Steady) | Conditions: Clear | Wind Direction: SSE | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; Today - Mostly sunny. Highs in the lower 90s. Southwest winds around 5 mph.; Tonight - Partly cloudy. A chance of showers and thunderstorms...mainly after midnight. Muggy. Lows in the lower 70s. Southwest winds around 5 mph. (1 more message)

05:24 <CoderForLife> &more

05:24 <Romulus> CoderForLife: Chance of rain 30 percent.; Friday - Partly sunny with a chance of showers and thunderstorms. Humid with highs around 90. Southwest winds 5 to 10 mph. Chance of rain 50 percent. Heat index values up to 101 in the afternoon.;

05:25 <CoderForLife> ugh

05:25 <CoderForLife> with the amount of money I pay, you'd think I'd get a happier forecast

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06:33 <hawmps> 'lo

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08:19 <efc> moo

08:19 <efc> &wx 31088

08:19 <Romulus> efc: Temperature: 77F / 25C | Humidity: 100% | Pressure: 30.04in / 1017hPa (Rising) | Conditions: Clear | Wind Direction: North | Wind Speed: 0mph / 0km/h ; Today - Mostly sunny. A 20 percent chance of showers and thunderstorms in the afternoon. Highs in the mid 90s. Northeast winds 5 to 10 mph shifting to the southeast in the afternoon.; Tonight - Partly cloudy in the evening then becoming mostly (1 more message)

08:20 <efc> &more

08:20 <Romulus> efc: cloudy. Lows in the mid 70s. Light and variable winds.; Friday - Partly sunny with a slight chance of showers and thunderstorms in the morning...then a chance of showers and thunderstorms in the afternoon. Highs in the lower 90s. Southwest winds 5 to 15 mph. Chance of rain 40 percent.;

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08:25 <hawmps> Temp 73.2 DP 73

08:25 <hawmps> icky-sticky

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11:48 <hawmps> &wx 12020

11:48 <Romulus> hawmps: Temperature: 85.1F / 29.5C | Humidity: 60% | Pressure: 29.79in / 1008.7hPa (Falling) | Conditions: Scattered Clouds | Wind Direction: NE | Wind Speed: 0.0mph / 0.0km/h ; This Afternoon - Mostly sunny. Highs in the upper 80s. Light and variable winds...becoming southeast around 5 mph.; Tonight - Mostly clear in the evening...then becoming partly cloudy. Humid with lows around 70. South winds (1 more message)

11:49 <hawmps> &more

11:49 <Romulus> hawmps: around 5 mph.; Friday - Partly sunny in the morning...then mostly cloudy with a chance of showers and thunderstorms in the afternoon. Humid with highs in the upper 80s. South winds 5 to 10 mph...becoming southwest in the afternoon. Chance of rain 50 percent.;

11:51 <yoyo[RKN]> in which of the Boinc server tables are the host venues stored?

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12:54 * _Danilo_ reboot

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15:43 <desti> well shuted in

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16:00 <xcamel> 'lo

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16:13 <zombie67> pov?

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16:27 <schproodle> I am trying dotsch/ux.  Anyone with experience using the live-cd with persistent /home on usb flash?

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22:09 <zombie67> so what's the deal with milkyway?

22:12 <PovAddict> zombie67: pong :P

22:13 <zombie67> hi

22:14 <zombie67> help me decode DA'e email

22:14 <zombie67> change in RAC->FLOPS

22:14 <PovAddict> still can't quite believe it

22:14 <zombie67> what does it mean?

22:14 <PovAddict> but I don't think it matters at this point

22:14 <zombie67> credits at SETI were too low or too high?

22:15 <PovAddict> possibly... however:

22:15 <PovAddict> - since in theory other projects were syncing their credit rates to SETI, all would be high

22:15 <PovAddict> (that's his argument, not mine :P)

22:16 <zombie67> sure

22:16 <zombie67> but which way were they wrong?

22:16 <zombie67> "SETI@home was computing credit based on (integer OPS + FLOPS)/2."

22:17 <PovAddict> - it's not like SETI is/was counting FLOPS accurately anyway (I don't think that's technically possible especially in modern CPUs), so whether a credit is 100 or 200 flops doesn't matter much IMHO :P

22:17 <zombie67> "This was incorrect"

22:17 <zombie67> but he doesn't way what he thinks *is* correct

22:17 <PovAddict> I think without the /2

22:17 <PovAddict> so it was too high?

22:18 <zombie67> "If your site shows FLOPS anywhere, please fix also."

22:18 <zombie67> uh, how?

22:19 <zombie67> maybe he meant it should be /200 instead of /2?

22:19 <zombie67> whatever difference that means

22:19 <zombie67> he already completely screwed up the credits on his own project

22:19 <zombie67> and I mean COMPLETELY screwed up

22:20 <PovAddict> I think SETI was computing credits based on "total operations = (integer ops + float ops) / 2" (later doing some factor like '100' on the total ops) when that /2 shouldn't have been there

22:20 <zombie67> Guh.  Why can't he be clear?

22:21 <PovAddict> "If your site shows FLOPS anywhere, please fix also." that means if a site like boincstats is dividing credits by a factor to show how many FLOPS the project is doing, they should change that factor

22:21 <zombie67> so what, are the seti credits going to drop even further now, and expect everyone else to still follow?

22:22 <PovAddict> no, credits aren't going to change

22:23 <zombie67> "SETI@home was computing credit based on (integer OPS + FLOPS)/2."

22:23 <zombie67> "This was incorrect"

22:23 <zombie67> ***was***

22:23 <zombie67> means he changed the credits

22:23 <PovAddict> credits were defined as "1/100th of a CPU-time day on a 1000-FLOP computer"

22:23 <PovAddict> SETI had a /2 division that it shouldn't have, making it not match that definition

22:23 <PovAddict> he changed the definition to match SETI mistake

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22:24 <zombie67> no, he changed how it is "computed"

22:24 <PovAddict> http://boinc.berkeley.edu/w/?title=Computation_credit&diff=2818&oldid=prev

22:24 <Romulus> <http://tinyurl.com/2c5kp4u> (at boinc.berkeley.edu)

22:24 <zombie67> either that, or he did not write what he did

22:24 <PovAddict> see first line changed

22:25 <zombie67> so he is cutting the credits by half

22:25 <zombie67> CS was 1/100, is now 1/200

22:26 <PovAddict> SETI was mistakenly calculating credits as if they were 1/200 CPU-day, so he changed the documentation to match the long-standing error (now documents reality)

22:26 <zombie67> that is a huge change

22:26 <zombie67> oh!

22:27 <zombie67> you are suggesting he is changing just the docs?

22:27 <zombie67> because his email does not say that at all

22:27 <PovAddict> his email is on the boinc_stats mailing lists

22:28 <PovAddict> so that stats sites showing "number of floating-point operations per second this project is doing" as a curiosity (like boincstats) fix how they calculate that number based on credits

22:28 <zombie67> yes, stats = credits...not docs

22:28 <PovAddict> he didn't care about anyone else :P

22:29 <PovAddict> his mail is addressed to admins of boinc statistic websites

22:29 <zombie67> yes, which is what I would expect if he was going to change how credits are awarded

22:29 <zombie67> otherwise, why would they care?

22:29 <zombie67> why would they care about the docs changing, I mean?

22:30 <PovAddict> http://boincstats.com/stats/project_graph.php?pr=sah

22:30 <Romulus> <http://tinyurl.com/36mkue3> (at boincstats.com)

22:30 <PovAddict> "Average floating point operations per second: 718,966.9 GigaFLOPS / 718.967 TeraFLOPS"

22:31 <PovAddict> in theory, that number is wrong by a factor of two (unless Willy read David's email already and fixed it)

22:31 <zombie67> so you are saying that his message was meant to tell willy to change his conversion formula?

22:31 <zombie67> and nothing more?

22:33 <PovAddict> and any other stats site that shows such a "FLOPS" number

22:33 <zombie67> wow, that is not how I read his email at all.

22:34 <PovAddict> "I fixed this on the BOINC site, where it shows total FLOPS and per-user FLOPS." refers to eg. http://boinc.berkeley.edu/chart_list.php

22:34 <Romulus> Title: Top 100 multi-project BOINC participants (at boinc.berkeley.edu)

22:36 <zombie67> Still, he says that SETI credits were wrong.  And then that they have been fixed.

22:37 <zombie67> nothing about just changing the FLOPS calc.

22:37 <PovAddict> he didn't say he fixed SETI credits

22:37 <zombie67> [19:23]  <zombie67> "SETI@home was computing credit based on (integer OPS + FLOPS)/2."

22:37 <zombie67> [19:23]  <zombie67> "This was incorrect"

22:37 <zombie67> [19:23]  <zombie67> ***was***

22:38 <zombie67> meaning they are different now

22:40 <zombie67> anyway, as long as he meant something different from what he wrote, and SETI credits are not changing, then no issue

22:41 <PovAddict> wow, Sudoku is retired?

22:41 <zombie67> yeah....it shut down a LONG time ago

22:42 <PovAddict> I still remember the list of retired projects in boincstats having like 5 projects

22:42 <PovAddict> and the list of active projects being as long as the list of retired ones is now

22:42 <zombie67> \march 2009

22:42 <zombie67> yeah

22:42 <zombie67> he could help fix that if he carried more of the projects

22:43 <PovAddict> PicEvolvr didn't last long...

22:43 <zombie67> like free-dc

22:43 <zombie67> long enough for me to get a 250 megamilestone

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23:43 <jadeia> Hi guys, could I ask a couple of questions regarding a sudden spate of errors with BOINC in the last few days?

23:44 <jadeia> I am receiving the following error: Internet access OK - project servers may be temporarily down - but had it for several days... I'm guessing that can't be right?

23:46 <jadeia> I have tried detaching from the project and reattaching to it (as per help files) but no dice

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