IRC logs of #boinc for Tuesday, 2012-03-06

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17:23 <wdsmia> &wx 50319

17:23 <Romulus> wdsmia: Temperature: 71.2F / 21.8C | Humidity: 33% | Pressure: 29.65in / 1003.9hPa (Steady) | Conditions: Overcast | Wind Direction: SSW | Wind Speed: 15.0mph / 24.1km/h ; Tuesday - Clear. High of 72F. Winds from the SSW at 5-15 mph with gusts to 35 mph.; Tuesday Night - Clear in the evening, then partly cloudy. Low of 50F. Winds from the SSW at 15-20 mph with gusts to 30 mph.; Wednesday - Overcast (1 more message)

17:23 <wdsmia> &more

17:23 <Romulus> wdsmia: with rain showers, then thunderstorms and rain showers in the afternoon. High of 63F. Winds from the SSW at 5-15 mph shifting to the WNW in the afternoon. Chance of rain 50%.;

17:30 <Romulus> New news from boinc: Promoting BOINC to local computer user's groups

17:39 <Tank_Master> would be nice if rommie had links to those new items...

17:51 <Tank_Master> &wx hio

17:51 <Romulus> Tank_Master: Temperature: 44F / 7C | Humidity: 47% | Pressure: 30.20in / 1023hPa (Steady) | Conditions: Mostly Cloudy | Wind Direction: Variable | Wind Speed: 6mph / 9km/h ; Tuesday - Mostly cloudy with snow showers and rain showers, then a chance of rain in the afternoon. High of 46F. Winds from the West at 5-10 mph. Chance of precipitation 60% .; Tuesday Night - Partly cloudy. Low of 27F. Winds (1 more message)

17:51 <Tank_Master> &more

17:51 <Romulus> Tank_Master: less than 5 mph.; Wednesday - Clear. High of 50F. Winds less than 5 mph.;

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18:24 <MTughan> Tank_Master: I passed you on BURP the other day. :)

18:24 <Tank_Master> oh right, forgot about htat project :P

18:25 <Tank_Master> im getting another badge in WCG atm

18:37 <MTughan> lol

18:37 <MTughan> I'm falling behind somewhat in BURP RAC standings now because I can't upload fast enough.

18:38 <MTughan> I'm limited to 20KB/s upload max if I want any semblence of connection stability.

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18:39 <MTughan> Which, sadly enough, is still a quarter of my top upload speed.

18:41 <Tank_Master> http://donateathome.org/ im #5 there

18:41 <Romulus> Title: Donate@Home (at donateathome.org)

18:41 <MTughan> Well, your host is anyway.

18:42 <MTughan> Very nice.

18:42 <Tank_Master> well, my hist is #5

18:42 <MTughan> What cards? 7970s?

18:42 <Tank_Master> thats with just a 7970 and a 6970

18:42 <MTughan> I see BOINC doesn't differentiate between the two.

18:42 <Tank_Master> no, it never has

18:43 <MTughan> How's the Win8 DP working out?

18:43 <Tank_Master> it just treets everything as the best card, and by default only works on the bext card

18:43 <Tank_Master> win8 has been good

18:43 <MTughan> Oh, it doesn't do anything on the 6970?

18:44 <Tank_Master> you have to enable "use all GPUs" in the cc_config.xml

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18:44 <MTughan> Eh, that's not too bad then.

18:44 <Tank_Master> no

18:45 <Tank_Master> but for someone that doesnt know of that cc_config...

18:45 <MTughan> Yeah.

18:46 <Tank_Master> it would be more ideal id BOINC would tell the server the actual cards, so the server can give different apps for different card capibilities

18:46 <PovAddict> what's your GPU?

18:46 <MTughan> Mine or TMs?

18:46 <arsenm> Yes, multiGPU support is completely broken

18:47 <MTughan> I've got a 6950. TM said he has a 7970 and a 6970.

18:47 <PovAddict> I found a website saying you need a year of bitcoin mining to break even

18:47 <PovAddict> for Radeon

18:47 <MTughan> I'm not sure I want to know how much the 7970 was...

18:47 <PovAddict> for nvidia this guy's stats say you always lose

18:47 <MTughan> Which are faster for Bitcoins? Nvidia or AMDs?

18:48 <Tank_Master> got it from newegg, about $560

18:48 <Tank_Master> AMD

18:48 <MTughan> I guess that answers that... :D

18:48 <PovAddict> http://bitminer.info/

18:48 <Romulus> Title: Bitcoin Mining Hardware Calculator (at bitminer.info)

18:48 <MTughan> Figures someone would make that.

18:48 <Tank_Master> AMD, MT

18:48 <MTughan> Tank_Master: Yeah, I saw. Thanks.

18:49 <Tank_Master> arg, sorry, the window got scroped up and I didnt relize it :P

18:49 <Tank_Master> scrolled*

18:49 <MTughan> You know, instead of spending $550+ on a new GPU, you should've spent more on a decent sized screen. :P

18:49 <Tank_Master> ive got 4 2048x1152 screens...

18:50 <MTughan> Then you have no excuse to miss something by having it scroll up then, do you?

18:51 <Tank_Master> i hit the mouse wheel when i was moving the mouse over to a different program

18:55 <MTughan> PovAddict: One problem with that table I notice... Why is the 6970 so cheap?

18:56 <MTughan> Apart from that result, it looks like the lowest break-even rate is 312 days on the 6790, or about 10 months.

18:56 <Tank_Master> ha i just noticed that to

18:56 <Tank_Master> should be more like $350

18:56 <MTughan> Tank_Master: Did you also notice that if you click on the link, it brings you to the Newegg page for an XFX PSU?

18:57 <Tank_Master> wow fail

18:58 <MTughan> That's interesting that no Nvidia GPUs break even though... Closest is the GT430.

19:00 <MTughan> Would be interesting to know what the numbers on the new 7xxx cards are though, especially with the new architecture that's apparently designed for GPGPU.

19:01 <PovAddict> simple

19:01 <PovAddict> run a miner and see how many mhash/sec you get, easy to do the maths after that

19:02 <MTughan> Check the wiki link from that page, some people already have.

19:02 <MTughan> Including someone who's mining on a 3x 7970 setup...

19:03 <MTughan> Anyway, you're looking at probably 650-700Mhash/s for a single card, while the guy with the triple setup was getting 1950Mhash/s.

19:03 <PovAddict> any idea how much power that setup could use?

19:04 <MTughan> Not sure I want to think about that... xD

19:04 <PovAddict> I'm trying to show it's not worth it :P

19:05 <MTughan> Give me a sec.

19:05 <MTughan> Do you know how hard the Bitcoin miner loads the card?

19:05 <Tank_Master> on my 7970 with donate@home, i get a 95% load according to MSI afterburner

19:06 <MTughan> You're probably looking at 260-275W then.

19:06 <Tank_Master> card is rated for 250w

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19:07 <MTughan> Say 250W then. I think that's probably closer to the target now that I'm looking at these graphs again.

19:07 <PovAddict> MTughan: 250w per card?

19:07 <MTughan> Yeah.

19:08 <PovAddict> so that's 750w... what electricity cost could we use?

19:08 <MTughan> For comparisons sake, use his number. $0.15 USD/kWh.

19:15 <MTughan> From my calculations, a 6970 would make $2.05/day.

19:15 <PovAddict> that gives me a stupidly high profit that can't possibly be right

19:16 <PovAddict> oh damn, I was calculating power for a single card and mining for three cards

19:16 <MTughan> Based on $560 to purchase, you'd make that back in 273 days.

19:17 <PovAddict> calculating for the 3x7970

19:18 <PovAddict> at $0.15/kWh, 750W, you spend $2.70/day

19:18 <PovAddict> at 1950Mhash/s, current difficulty rate, $4.90/bitcoin, you make $6.42/day

19:19 <PovAddict> how much would 3x7970 cost?

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19:19 <MTughan> 3x $560.

19:19 <Tank_Master> 575x3

19:19 <MTughan> You'd be making 3x the coin for 3x the purchase price. Still the same repay rate.

19:19 <Tank_Master> 1725

19:20 <MTughan> $1725 / $6.42/day comes out at 268 days.

19:20 <Tank_Master> the main advantage would be loser system power overhead (once cpu, one mobo, one hd instead of 3)

19:20 <Tank_Master> lower*

19:20 <MTughan> Assuming you can absorb the initial purchase price plus the initial electricity costs.

19:20 <PovAddict> MTughan: note it was $6.42 gross, not net

19:20 <Tank_Master> yeah

19:20 <MTughan> Plus, I bet that Bitcoins aren't worth that much anymore.

19:21 <MTughan> PovAddict: That's true, yeah... Electricity rate was $0.90 per card.

19:21 <PovAddict> you need to subtract the $2.70/day costs

19:21 <MTughan> $3.72.day,,,

19:21 <MTughan> 504 days.

19:21 <PovAddict> http://www.wolframalpha.com/input/?i=plot+6.42x%2C+%28575*3%29%2B2.70x

19:22 <Romulus> <http://tinyurl.com/7ua4sxj> (at www.wolframalpha.com)

19:22 <MTughan> About 1.4 years.

19:23 <Tank_Master> by which time youll have a new card...

19:23 <MTughan> First line is the amount of Bitcoins you'd make, second is actual card cost plus electricity?

19:23 <PovAddict> MTughan: yes

19:23 <PovAddict> no

19:23 <PovAddict> first line is the amount of dollars you'd make

19:24 <MTughan> Using the static Bitcoin exchange rate, right.

19:24 <PovAddict> 1950mhash/s currently gets you 1.31btc/day

19:24 <PovAddict> I took $4.90/btc from current mtgox exchange rate

19:24 <PovAddict> however, in all this time, difficulty *will* raise

19:24 <MTughan> I hate exponentials...

19:25 <PovAddict> well the difficulty raise isn't exponential

19:25 <PovAddict> it's relative to how much mining power is in the network, so it may fluctuate as much as exchange rate

19:26 <MTughan> The more power, the higher the difficulty?

19:26 <PovAddict> yes

19:26 <PovAddict> the difficulty is periodically adjusted so that there is a constant network-wide rate of bitcoin generation

19:26 <MTughan> So just bringing in 3x 7970s would raise the difficulty, although not probably an appreciable amount.

19:26 <PovAddict> yup

19:28 <PovAddict> MTughan: also, once 10.5 million bitcoins are generated globally, the payment for generating a block will suddenly drop from 50 to 25

19:29 <PovAddict> and the difficulty adjustment is done in terms of block generation rate, not bitcoins assigned

19:29 <PovAddict> so with unmodified difficulty, btc/day for everyone will suddenly drop by half

19:29 <PovAddict> "The 10.5 million mark will likely occur around December of this year, but could deviate based on the rate of change in mining capacity with the target being hit in November or January instead being a possibility.  At that point, exactly half (50%) of all bitcoins that will ever be issued will have been issued."

19:34 <MTughan> PovAddict: Well, that puts a damper on the 1.4 year plan then.

19:34 <MTughan> Makes it into more of a 2 year plan.

19:34 <MTughan> About .75 years with normal difficulty, the rest at half speed.

19:36 <PovAddict> difficulty to generate a block is always rising, and exchange rate fluctuates, and who knows what will happen to electricity prices by then...

19:36 <PovAddict> MTughan: did you see DA's opinion of donate@home?

19:36 <Tank_Master> i heard that he doesnt like it, but i havent seen anythign spcific he said

19:38 <MTughan> No, I didn't.

19:40 <PovAddict> hmph

19:41 <PovAddict> you need to be subscribed to boinc_stats mailing list to see it

19:41 <PovAddict> hold on

19:42 <PovAddict> MTughan: http://paste.kde.org/434600/33108092/

19:42 <Romulus> Title: #434600 KDE Pastebin (at paste.kde.org)

19:43 <Tank_Master> pfft, he clearly has no clue whats going on at dontae@home

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