IRC logs of #boinc for Saturday, 2014-10-11

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01:28 <he1kki> Hi boincers! I recently added einstein@home to my crunching fleet, and it seems to give me more cobblestones than any other project. As nice that it its, I feel that those numbers are a bit too good to be true

01:30 <he1kki> I mean, my RAC was almost doubled, though it's not possible as I haven't added any serious cpu-power recently

01:30 <he1kki>

01:30 <Romulus> <> (at

01:32 <he1kki> There is a slight change that this is actually something to do with maintenance breaks and some manual fixing of points form server side

01:32 <he1kki> /form/from/

01:37 <he1kki> hmm, now that I think of it, source of the problem could actually be

01:39 <he1kki> As climateprediction packages can take weeks to complete, cobblestones from it are usually given retroactively.

01:40 <he1kki> And now that that project has had some downtime + F-secure has been annoyingly confident that those data packages has trojan inside them

01:42 <he1kki> maybe that RAC is actually correct, and reason why it's rising is that I gave that low priority

01:43 <he1kki> Well, it was a stupid idea anyway to run Windows OS just to participate that single project.

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15:59 <TyphooN`> Gridcoin (Proof of Research) Cryptocurrency launched today. - Earn cryptocurrency for BOINC research! Join us in #gridcoin

15:59 <Romulus> Title: Gridcoin - Home (at

16:11 <PovAddict> launched today?

16:13 <TyphooN`> the new blockchain and wallet launched today.  last october the original version of gridcoin launched, and those coins are being converted

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17:24 <Switeck> Lately, I'm seeing Asteroids get quite a few download failed on work units...anyone else notice this?

17:25 <Switeck> And Einstein is getting lots of computation errors.

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17:43 <seekr> looking to gain understanding of the SETI@home software setup, and a better grasp of how and why vbox is used than what I've been able to learn from what's at and/or

17:43 <Romulus> Title: VirtualBox - BOINC (at

17:45 <seekr> Just discovered - will try there.

17:45 <Romulus> <> (at

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18:23 <PovAddict> seekr: VirtualBox is only needed for some projects

18:23 <PovAddict> SETI@Home doesn't need it

18:24 <PovAddict> so you can get BOINC without VBox if you plan to only run SETI

18:25 <seekr> PovAddict: thanks for the info

18:26 <seekr> Well, I'm seeking to understand whether things have changed a lot since I originally learned about seti@home, maybe a decade or so ago, when it was fairly new - at that time, only windows was supported.

18:28 <seekr> From what I read on the site, it seems that the application is now written for Linux (which wasn't even supported when I looked into the subject a long time ago), so vbox is required to run the app. (?)  But I see there's a win-only installer also, which leaves me somewhat confused, PovAddict.

18:29 <PovAddict> Test4Theory and ATLAS@Home are the only projects I know that need vbox

18:29 <seekr> Ah.  Do all projects, some or most have both Linux & Win versions?

18:29 <Switeck> It could be that the Linux version is faster running under vbox than the windows-only version.

18:30 <Switeck> or the Linux version might be faster running under Linux natively.

18:30 <seekr> Switeck: I saw something there about the advantages of the Linux version, including for the developers.

18:31 <Switeck> I've heard of projects with both Windows and Linux versions having one version (on 1 OS) lagging behind the other.

18:32 <seekr> I'm in the setup process of a new Intel-based machine for my uncle.  I'd wanted to run Linux on it, but for various reasons have accepted its running under Windoze.  I have to tweak the BIOS (with some help from HP or someone, since I can't see the screen, being on the other side of a vast continent), so that the virtualisation is enabled, which is required for vbox.

18:33 <seekr> There will be lots spare cycles on the box, since he uses it only for email and web surfing - and I'm running a bittorrent client on it, so want to find some worthy projects to soak up some spare cycles.

18:34 <Switeck> some bittorrent clients are "harder" on the cpu than others. I don't recommend Tixati for that reason alone...

18:35 <seekr> I plan to run vbox anyway, to give me a Linux playpen - don't know whether if the Linux versions of projects are used, they can run in that same LInux VM or if they will want their own VMs.  I hope they can run as apps under the Linux I'll install (probably Linux Mint 17).

18:37 <seekr> Switeck: I've been using ╬╝torrent 1.8.2 (an old version, required for some trackers) - it seems to have few system resource req'ts.

18:38 <Switeck> I don't know why they'd require that particular version...but ok.

18:39 <seekr> Switeck: has to do with usage reporting - seems later versions of ╬╝torrent, as well as all versions of other clients permit one to cheat and artificially boost ratio.

18:40 <Switeck> I've heard it depends on whether "excess" is counted for download and upload purposes. not a cheat, and exploits certainly exist above-and-beyond that even in earlier versions of uT

18:41 <seekr> oh - all I know is that one can get banned from these trackers for using non-approved versions - I've never looked into the details.

18:41 <Switeck> distributed downloading often tries to get the last few parts from multiple sources at once, resulting in duplication.

18:42 <seekr> I see.  Anyway, it sounds as if I may have to assess both versions of software for BOINC projects on a case by case basis, selecting whichever version seems better.

18:43 <Switeck> even harder, sometimes a BOINC project may be immensely better on a GPU...and even AMD vs Nvidia sped differences.

18:44 <seekr> hmmm - I use AMD chips on my own machines, but the machine in question has an Intel one - I gotta find out how to turn on virtualisation in the BIOS.

18:45 <seekr> I've done it on my own machines, but will have to find a writeup or find an expert to do it on my uncle's machine, I guess.

18:46 <seekr> It should be quite easy - hard part is talking him through the procedure (he's quite elderly and easily confused/frustrated).

18:46 <Switeck> yours use hyperthreading?

18:46 <seekr> I dunno.  My machines are about 5-6 years old.

18:47 <Switeck> I think it's been around for >8 years now

18:47 <seekr> I just know there's a mode one can select via the BIOS to enable the feature needed by vbox.

18:48 <seekr> Does that info help, Switeck?

18:49 <Switeck> I haven't tried virtualization or vbox.

18:49 <seekr> CPU~Dual core AMD Athlon II M320 (-MCP-) clocked at Min:800.000Mhz Max:2100.000Mhz Kernel~3.5.0-27-generic x86_64 Up~12 days Mem~2020.5/2755.9MB HDD~4751.0GB(71.2% used) Procs~248 Client~X-Chat 2.8.8 inxi~1.9.16

18:50 <Switeck> at least it's dual old Pentium 4's I have

18:51 <seekr> oh - sorry - it's an HP lappie

18:51 <Switeck> 3 GB ram?

18:52 <Switeck> there are a few BOINC projects that need lots of ram

18:52 <seekr> I'll have to sniff around to find what appear to be the most worthy BOINC-using projects.  I like the idea of SETI@home, but I'm sorta persuaded that the SETI effort itself may be "barkng up the wrong tree" as regards finding evidence of ET life and civilisation.

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18:53 <Switeck> I run milky way, asteroids, collatz, einstein, and moo wrapper.

18:53 <seekr> Switeck: yeah - I didn't know the requirements of a full-fledged Linux box when I got the machine about five years ago.  Now I'd insist on at least 8GB.

18:53 <Switeck> I have enough redundancy so if 1 project has downtime the others are still busy.

18:54 <seekr> My uncle's machine has 8GB, and a four core CPU.

18:54 <seekr> quad core, guess it's called

18:54 <Switeck> yep

18:54 <seekr> so it should be a fine machine for BOINC stuff

18:55 <Switeck> quite nice in fact...hope the GPU is useful too.

18:55 <seekr> Do you have any favourite projects you'd like to recommend?

18:55 <Switeck> milky way and asteroids are great for learning about 'basic' astronomy

18:56 <Switeck> finding out the Milky Way Galaxy is/has devouring/destroying smaller galaxies is a bit of a shocker at first.

18:56 <seekr> hmmm

18:57 <seekr> What do you think about Halton Arp's ideas?

18:57 <Switeck> who? :P

18:57 <seekr> He's a steady-stater, like the late great Sir Fred Hoyle.

18:58 <seekr> He published something about peculiar galaxies.

18:58 <seekr> Got him in lotsa trouble with his colleagues and higher-ups - they took away his telescope time - ran him out of the U.S., in fact - he found a home at the Max Planck Institute - think he died fairly recently.

18:59 <Switeck> electric universe theory

18:59 <seekr> no - but that's interesting also

18:59 <seekr> He observes that red shift is not clearly associated with ideas about an expanding universe.

19:00 <seekr> He finds evidence for what appear to be galaxies that are associated with one another that have substantially different red shifts from one another.

19:01 <seekr> I spoke with someone a few years back who claimed that new observations substantiate that those galaxies are not in fact associated with one another - just an optical illusion, or some such, but Dr Arp still has his defenders, I believe.

19:01 <Switeck> redshift to me seems extremely likely to be related to distance, although some can be 'ejecta' events of galactic groups

19:02 <seekr> I saw a video several years ago that explains the whole thing - made in Denmark, as I recall.  I can maybe find it if you're interested.

19:02 <Switeck> it's only been the last few years that a quasar's host galaxy could even barely be resolved...probably due to extreme distance.

19:03 <Switeck> they're likely to be bigger galaxies and we can't even see most of them.

19:03 <seekr> The electric universe folks embrace the ideas of Halton Arp, btw.

19:04 <seekr>

19:04 <Romulus> Title: Catastrophism Products (at

19:05 <Switeck> the electric universe theories attempt to explain away "dark matter" gravity issues, and I think they do poorly in that regard.

19:07 <seekr> I don't know enough of the basics to be able to properly evaluate such ideas.  I just know that the people espousing such ideas are fairly "electric" themselves - almost dogmatic, in fact.

19:07 <Switeck> The Milky Way project tries to determine stellar associations/groups based on redshift and brightness.

19:08 <Switeck> these suggest this super-galaxy has lots of stellar "streams" left over in its halo from dwarf galaxies that it has absorbed.

19:08 <seekr> URL?

19:08 <Switeck>

19:08 <Romulus> Title: MilkyWay@Home (at

19:08 <seekr> ok - I'll mark it as a candidate - thanks

19:09 <seekr> I found evidence of a PDF file containing Dr Arp's redshift ideas, but can't find a source.

19:10 <seekr> Ah - found some on his own site (maybe he's still alive - I dunno)

19:10 <Switeck> asteroids attempts to create a topology for asteroids based on their light-curves.

19:10 <Romulus> Title: Articles - Halton Arp's official website (at

19:11 <seekr> ok

19:11 <Switeck>    HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found

19:11 <Romulus> <> (at

19:11 <seekr> hmmm

19:12 <seekr> It's an HTML error - try

19:12 <Romulus> <> (at

19:15 <Switeck> I did, that worked

19:16 <seekr> good - I'd be interested to know what you think of his ideas, which I know may take you some time to work out, if you have enough interest to look into what he claims.

19:16 <Switeck> Ejected quasars could well explain a few, after all redshift is definitely speed-difference related

19:17 <Switeck> but there are definitely some extremely distant quasars

19:18 <Switeck> those ejected quasars could be a dwarf galaxy's galactic "core" black hole that was ejected after the rest of that galaxy was "absorbed" by the larger nearby galaxy.

19:18 <Switeck> ...which would also explain why that core black hole was in an active "quasar" state.

19:18 <seekr> There's another fringey sort of scientist who claims that bodies of the mass involved in some of the higher-frequency quasar transmissions couldn't possibly be spinning fast enough to produce those effects, so he looks for another methanism.

19:19 <seekr> Dr Paul LaViolette

19:24 <Switeck> Even a perfectly aligned neutron star "magnetar" with a steady inflow of gas could produce a maser.   these often have crazy-high spin rates.

19:24 <Romulus> Title: Magnetar - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at

19:27 <seekr> hmmm - just found a link to someone questioning whether Dr LaViolette's theories have any substance

19:27 <seekr>

19:27 <Romulus> Title: Sub-Quantum Kinetics impressive verifications (at

19:33 <seekr> Ah - reading that page, I see that Paul LaViolette has also gotten into the game of attempting to debunk today's conventional expanding universe ideas.

19:33 <seekr> "Prediction No. 3 (1978): As a basic requirement of the validity of its methodology, subquantum kinetics predicted that photons should gradually redshift with time when passing through regions of low (less negative) gravitational field potential, e.g. intergalactic space. It predicted a "tired-light effect," that distant galaxies should appear redshifted without the need of postulating recessional motion. "

19:37 <seekr> I know there was a recent observational finding that appears to confirm the expanding universe idea - I don't recall the details, since I don't follow such things closely, and don't know whether it has or can invalidate these sorts of ideas.

19:38 <seekr> Switeck: ^^

19:39 <Switeck> recent as opposed to all the others? XD

19:40 <seekr> yeah, well - this one sounded like a very big deal - I'll see if I can find the story

19:40 <Switeck>

19:40 <Romulus> Title: Vacuum energy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (at

19:42 <seekr> thanks

19:43 <seekr> I haven't yet found what I was looking for, but I came across another I'd saved:

19:43 <Romulus> <> (at

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21:17 <CoderForLife> &wx 45140

21:17 <Romulus> CoderForLife: Temperature: 52.0░F / 11.1░C | Humidity: 77% | Pressure: 30.16in / 1021hPa (Steady) | Conditions: Clear | Wind Direction: NE | Wind Speed: 1.1mph / 1.8km/h ; Saturday - Partly cloudy. High of 63F. Winds from the NNE at 5 to 10 mph.; Saturday Night - Partly cloudy. Low of 45F. Winds from the NE at 5 to 10 mph.; Sunday - Mostly cloudy with a chance of a thunderstorm and a chance of rain (1 more message)

21:17 <CoderForLife> &more

21:17 <Romulus> CoderForLife: in the afternoon. High of 66F. Winds from the North at 5 to 10 mph shifting to the SE in the afternoon. Chance of rain 50%.;

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